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Re: Working, Real NCAA Model
Posted: Tue Mar 07, 2017 1:25 pm
by BKarchitect
Primis wrote:Alessandro wrote:Talking about your attempt... I think the only thing is that it seems you can sign only free agents. I tried to add a transfer period to the Big Ten, but you can only buy players off other college teams. You can't recruit off USHL, for example.
Maybe this is why you think it's unplayable?
Having only had a teeny little bit of time with it, I'm pretty impressed with what I see.
I'm honestly not sure why you can't sign guys off USHL teams. I would assume (haven't looked yet) that extends to not being able to sign off high school teams as well. That's tough though because it sure looks like the AI NCAA teams can still recruit/sign from those leagues. I wonder if the problem isn't a setting with the NCAA leagues, but with the USHL/HS ones? Is it just the age overlap? Actually, poking around... there is no age range set for the NCAA leagues? There probably should be. I realize technically there isn't in real life, but realistically you're not really getting any guys above 24 years old, it's mainly 18-23 years. Maybe need those flags in under Extra Rules.
The 4 year "contracts" and everything though.... it looks pretty good. If we can hash out the USHL/HS signing thing, I don't really know that there's any big problem with the rest of the model or structure. The tournament/Frozen Four thing is a very minor thing IMHO. It's maybe not 100% accurate, but it'd be VERY playable and a unique experience. I'm really looking forward to digging into this more. This might also be a good springboard to then get the CIS and say the BCHL playable as well....
Thanks - Yeah I mean it's certainly playable it's just you can't really offer commits in a realistIf way yet as human GM. Even if you are human GM of a team your team will still randomly add commits I believe though. It's just appears to be an internal process.
Also I'm hoping if high school and Canadian JR A leagues like BCHL get more fleshed out it will create a more robust pool for NCAA teams.
Re: Working, Real NCAA Model
Posted: Tue Mar 07, 2017 1:33 pm
by Primis
Alessandro wrote:Primis wrote:
I'm honestly not sure why you can't sign guys off USHL teams.
Must be something hardcoded, like why you can't approach CHL players with european teams...
I am getting a few commitments though simming with a human manager. And you can still sign free agents.
I think it would make for a great challenge. And yes probably we need to set a 24 top age.
I have only poked around the editor in 5 min. chunks this morning in between taking kids to 3 different schools at different times, but I'd like to see what having age range flags set for NCAA and whatnot does. I know the USHL is playable in this DB, but the same issue exists for the NAHL (2nd tier US junior), in that you can't recruit/sign guys from there either. So that's USHL, NAHL, and then I'm guessing all HS leagues (though I only checked 2 or 3 states' worth).
Give me a bit today with the editor and I'll see what I can do about the age range things myself and if it makes any diffference.
There's a lot of good stuff here though. It's very close, so long as the NCCA tourney thing isn't a deal-breaker for someone.
EDIT: Also, isn't there something in the editor that allows you to set a league as a subordinate league, junior, or feeder league? To kind of make a pecking order? I've always assumed that was something for EUropean competitions, but maybe something with that might be applicable as well?
Re: Working, Real NCAA Model
Posted: Tue Mar 07, 2017 1:53 pm
by BKarchitect
So when you shortlist a USHL/HS/etc player your team shows up in their profile under "interested" along with, potentially, other NCAA teams. I wonder if this gives you any higher chance for said player to commit to your school? I haven't tried but if you take control of a team and shortlist like every uncommitted player - I wonder if you will see an uptick in signed recruits?
Will the player look at his shortlist and perhaps commit to the program with the highest rep or closest geographical location or some other factor or is it simply window dressing and the CPU kind of randomly assigns college interested players to programs?
Because money is not an issue - is showing interest essentially like recruiting and then the player picks from the interested list?
Re: Working, Real NCAA Model
Posted: Tue Mar 07, 2017 2:39 pm
by Alessandro
Primis wrote:
EDIT: Also, isn't there something in the editor that allows you to set a league as a subordinate league, junior, or feeder league? To kind of make a pecking order? I've always assumed that was something for EUropean competitions, but maybe something with that might be applicable as well?
Unfortunately there is no such setting, not in America, nor in Europe. I think I have asked Riz about it since EHM freeware, though
You can't sign no players, no matter the league. You do get random commitments, but they are from low-level leagues. Too low for my taste.
Re: Working, Real NCAA Model
Posted: Tue Mar 07, 2017 3:42 pm
by sensaa
BKarchitect wrote:sensaa wrote:My NCAA league attempt have 48 Teams and i'm not getting any error with the season preview, so it's strange thats it happen at 60
Somewhere between 48 and 60 it always creates an error in the news item "season preview". Do you mind tryIng to add more teams to see if it affects your version?
So i added 12 team in a hurry to make it 60 and i got a crash with the season preview too "NEWS_ITEM::get_data() the index is invalid".
Re: Working, Real NCAA Model
Posted: Tue Mar 07, 2017 3:50 pm
by Primis
So, you can't "sign" junior and high school players as a NCAA team because the NCAA leagues have been set to "IIHF (no trades)" transfer system. If you set the NCAA leagues to "North American" transfer system, they can then sign guys from USHL, NAHL, etc, and also high school. I set a flag for min. contract age of 18, and a max age of 23 for all the NCAA leagues, and for guys that are too young you can select the option to go sign them but when you go to select their role they're all grayed and hashed out, so you can't actually do it until they're 18.
The next question is then is, since North American system allows trading, if there's still a way to manually kill trading entirely. I know you can set trade windows and whatnot, so maybe I can set a manual trade window that won't actually allow any trading or something.
Also, I'd really like more info on what BKarchitect was talking about, in terms of Shortlisting and waiting to see if they'll then commit to you, because that'd be an awesome way of handling it to be honest, and the NCAA leagues coudl then just stay on "IIHF (no trades)". That really WOULD be a legit recruiting system IMO, and would brilliant.
Re: Working, Real NCAA Model
Posted: Tue Mar 07, 2017 4:02 pm
by Alessandro
Primis wrote:So, you can't "sign" junior and high school players as a NCAA team because the NCAA leagues have been set to "IIHF (no trades)" transfer system. If you set the NCAA leagues to "North American" transfer system, they can then sign guys from USHL, NAHL, etc, and also high school. I set a flag for min. contract age of 18, and a max age of 23 for all the NCAA leagues, and for guys that are too young you can select the option to go sign them but when you go to select their role they're all grayed and hashed out, so you can't actually do it until they're 18.
The next question is then is, since North American system allows trading, if there's still a way to manually kill trading entirely. I know you can set trade windows and whatnot, so maybe I can set a manual trade window that won't actually allow any trading or something.
Also, I'd really like more info on what BKarchitect was talking about, in terms of Shortlisting and waiting to see if they'll then commit to you, because that'd be an awesome way of handling it to be honest, and the NCAA leagues coudl then just stay on "IIHF (no trades)". That really WOULD be a legit recruiting system IMO, and would brilliant.
Imho it's better with signing and "trades". I highly doubt teams would make many trades too.
I don't think shortlisting etc will guarantee a commitment.
Re: Working, Real NCAA Model
Posted: Tue Mar 07, 2017 4:41 pm
by Primis
For giggles I wondered what setting up a trade window of February 30th to February 31st would do. Pretend dates and all...
Upon loading/starting the new career, the game auto-corrects that to Feb. 29th as the start and end date. Which is too bad in a way (I'd hoped maybe I could limit the trade window to a time that doesn't actually exist), but also interesting (to know it doesn't just crash it to put in a fake date). I wonder what happens on a non-Leap Year with that Feb. 29th date? If I can find some way to make a trade window that is as useless as possible, I think using the North American transfer system would be just fine.
Re: Working, Real NCAA Model
Posted: Tue Mar 07, 2017 5:43 pm
by Alessandro
So if anyone agrees, we're gonna add this league with north american transfer system and limits 18-24 years old.
Re: Working, Real NCAA Model
Posted: Tue Mar 07, 2017 6:12 pm
by Alessandro
Can anyone confirm that the history to be added is this one?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_N ... _champions
EDIT: Should we add any player award? Even if maybe there are no official awards I'd say it'd be cool to have like top scorer listed.
Re: Working, Real NCAA Model
Posted: Tue Mar 07, 2017 6:41 pm
by Primis
That wikipedia list looks good and accurate.
I was going to look into this next. Each conference (league) names their own All-Conference teams, and IIRC there's an all-NCAA and/or All-Frozen Four equivalent as well.
The only real individual award of note is the Hobey Baker Award: MVP of the entire NCAA Division I.
There is also a Mike Richter Award, which goes to the top goaltender in all the NCAA. It's only like 3 or 4 years old IIRC.
Hobey Baker is *the* award though. The NCAA equivalent of the Hart trophy.
Re: Working, Real NCAA Model
Posted: Tue Mar 07, 2017 7:49 pm
by Alessandro
I fear that with the league set up that way, we can't have a NCAA-wide award. Maybe other than All-Star Conference teams and frozen four we can have a Frozen Four MVP?
Re: Working, Real NCAA Model
Posted: Tue Mar 07, 2017 7:59 pm
by Manimal
Alessandro wrote:I fear that with the league set up that way, we can't have a NCAA-wide award. Maybe other than All-Star Conference teams and frozen four we can have a Frozen Four MVP?
The Canadian Hockey League has awards that involve all three major junior leagues in the game. Have a look at their settings and maybe it is doable
EDIT: The Hobey Baker Award is in the db, as well
Re: Working, Real NCAA Model
Posted: Tue Mar 07, 2017 8:13 pm
by Primis
Manimal wrote:Alessandro wrote:I fear that with the league set up that way, we can't have a NCAA-wide award. Maybe other than All-Star Conference teams and frozen four we can have a Frozen Four MVP?
The Canadian Hockey League has awards that involve all three major junior leagues in the game. Have a look at their settings and maybe it is doable
EDIT: The Hobey Baker Award is in the db, as well
I think Archi said that stuff shows, but is not editable. Not yet anyways. None of the Extra Rules flag are applicable at this time.
Re: Working, Real NCAA Model
Posted: Tue Mar 07, 2017 8:32 pm
by archibalduk
Alessandro wrote:Primis wrote:
EDIT: Also, isn't there something in the editor that allows you to set a league as a subordinate league, junior, or feeder league? To kind of make a pecking order? I've always assumed that was something for EUropean competitions, but maybe something with that might be applicable as well?
Unfortunately there is no such setting, not in America, nor in Europe. I think I have asked Riz about it since EHM freeware, though
You can't sign no players, no matter the league. You do get random commitments, but they are from low-level leagues. Too low for my taste.
Yes there is. In the Editor go to the Club Competitions Screen. You'll see for each league there is a "Classification" group of settings relating to Classification, Division Level and Parent Competition.
Primis wrote:For giggles I wondered what setting up a trade window of February 30th to February 31st would do. Pretend dates and all...
Upon loading/starting the new career, the game auto-corrects that to Feb. 29th as the start and end date. Which is too bad in a way (I'd hoped maybe I could limit the trade window to a time that doesn't actually exist), but also interesting (to know it doesn't just crash it to put in a fake date). I wonder what happens on a non-Leap Year with that Feb. 29th date? If I can find some way to make a trade window that is as useless as possible, I think using the North American transfer system would be just fine.
Days in the database are treated as day number of the year. So 0 = 1 Jan, 1 = 2 Jan, etc. It's just that the Editor presents this number as a date (as does the game) - so trying to fudge the date won't have the results you'd expect. E.g. 29 Feb will be treated as 1 March for non-leap years.
Primis wrote:Manimal wrote:Alessandro wrote:I fear that with the league set up that way, we can't have a NCAA-wide award. Maybe other than All-Star Conference teams and frozen four we can have a Frozen Four MVP?
The Canadian Hockey League has awards that involve all three major junior leagues in the game. Have a look at their settings and maybe it is doable
EDIT: The Hobey Baker Award is in the db, as well
I think Archi said that stuff shows, but is not editable. Not yet anyways. None of the Extra Rules flag are applicable at this time.
Everything shows in the latest version released earlier this year.
The CHL awards are linked to the Memorial Cup (which is linked to all three CHL leagues via the Rules and Structure settings). So I expect that's how those awards straddle the three leagues.
Re: Working, Real NCAA Model
Posted: Tue Mar 07, 2017 9:23 pm
by Alessandro
archibalduk wrote:Alessandro wrote:Primis wrote:
EDIT: Also, isn't there something in the editor that allows you to set a league as a subordinate league, junior, or feeder league? To kind of make a pecking order? I've always assumed that was something for EUropean competitions, but maybe something with that might be applicable as well?
Unfortunately there is no such setting, not in America, nor in Europe. I think I have asked Riz about it since EHM freeware, though
You can't sign no players, no matter the league. You do get random commitments, but they are from low-level leagues. Too low for my taste.
Yes there is. In the Editor go to the Club Competitions Screen. You'll see for each league there is a "Classification" group of settings relating to Classification, Division Level and Parent Competition.
This is not what we mean. We mean to specify a league where teams get players from. I hope I'm clear now
Re: Working, Real NCAA Model
Posted: Tue Mar 07, 2017 10:11 pm
by archibalduk
Ok I'm with you. I read it as meaning pecking order/hierarchy.
That said, does anybody definitively know what effect, if any, those Classification settings have?
Re: Working, Real NCAA Model
Posted: Tue Mar 07, 2017 10:22 pm
by Alessandro
Of course, classification means the type of league that the league is (domestic pro, domestic junior, international). That said, this must be tied with teams, and it's hardcoded I think as if you change for example from junior league to pro league, junior teams will stay junior no matter what you put in the editor (I told you in the other thread, do you remember?)
Division level, is of course the "tier" of the league compared with same-kind league, and if it's not correct the game crashes (that means, in Sweden SHL is 01, Allsvenskan is 02, and so on)
Parent competition is used for divisions to specify the higher-ranked sibling, and same for All-Star competitions.
Re: Working, Real NCAA Model
Posted: Tue Mar 07, 2017 10:36 pm
by archibalduk
Alessandro wrote:Of course, classification means the type of league that the league is (domestic pro, domestic junior, international). That said, this must be tied with teams, and it's hardcoded I think as if you change for example from junior league to pro league, junior teams will stay junior no matter what you put in the editor (I told you in the other thread, do you remember?)
Yes I remember. It's on my list.
I assume the club pro settings have no bearing on the effect of this setting?
Re: Working, Real NCAA Model
Posted: Tue Mar 07, 2017 10:43 pm
by Alessandro
archibalduk wrote:Alessandro wrote:Of course, classification means the type of league that the league is (domestic pro, domestic junior, international). That said, this must be tied with teams, and it's hardcoded I think as if you change for example from junior league to pro league, junior teams will stay junior no matter what you put in the editor (I told you in the other thread, do you remember?)
Yes I remember. It's on my list.
I assume the club pro settings have no bearing on the effect of this setting?
Not really as I think you should be able to change both things. And who knows what's hardcoded and what's not
Re: Working, Real NCAA Model
Posted: Wed Mar 08, 2017 1:21 am
by zbguy
Alessandro wrote:Of course, classification means the type of league that the league is (domestic pro, domestic junior, international). That said, this must be tied with teams, and it's hardcoded I think as if you change for example from junior league to pro league, junior teams will stay junior no matter what you put in the editor (I told you in the other thread, do you remember?)
Division level, is of course the "tier" of the league compared with same-kind league, and if it's not correct the game crashes (that means, in Sweden SHL is 01, Allsvenskan is 02, and so on)
Parent competition is used for divisions to specify the higher-ranked sibling, and same for All-Star competitions.
Question on parent competitions: If I were to set the NHL as the AHL's parent competition for instance, the game would interpret that to mean that the AHL is *part* of the NHL the same way the Metropolitan Division is?
Re: Working, Real NCAA Model
Posted: Wed Mar 08, 2017 6:49 am
by Alessandro
I think it will eventually lead to a crash...
Re: Working, Real NCAA Model
Posted: Wed Mar 08, 2017 11:56 am
by BKarchitect
I noticed an error in my Frozen Four tournament setup - it's not properly selecting the top 4 teams for the 4-team playoff but I can't figure out which setting I have wrong. Might want to take a look before releasing:
Re: Working, Real NCAA Model
Posted: Wed Mar 08, 2017 12:58 pm
by Alessandro
I also noticed all games are at "unknown arena".
How does the host is picked IRL?
Re: Working, Real NCAA Model
Posted: Wed Mar 08, 2017 1:11 pm
by BKarchitect
Alessandro wrote:I also noticed all games are at "unknown arena".
How does the host is picked IRL?
The Frozen Four is bid on by cities - generally ones with an NHL infrastructure (every host since 2006 has been an NHL city) although more regional cities with close proximity to NCAA programs like Milwaukee, Providence, Orlando and Omaha have bid and in the case of the former two, have hosted in the past. In modern times it has not been hosted by NCAA university home arenas. The infrastructure to sell more tickets and have the hotel and host facilities is generally not there in most campus towns unless they are an urban setting like Columbus or Providence.