EHM The Blue Line

darn... Vancouver really has it together. Much of this seems to be addition by subtraction as they say. Without the Bertuzzi distractions and without Crawford and he clashing not to mention Crawford's inexplicable love affair with Dan Cloutier in goal (which continues but luckily for Vancouver it continues in a new locale this year!) this team looks to really be on the path to Cup finally.

The additions made are the kinds that are made by Cup bound teams; Pyatt has blended into the system perfectly and at a much cheaper pricepoint than giving in to Anson Carter.

Getting Luongo was worth double what they paid and as previosuly mentioned it cleared the 'room of Bertuzzi's sourpuss.

This defense reminds me of the unheralded group that took Carolina to the Cup last year in a lot of ways. They're darn solid and have people just quietly going about their business but getting the job done in a big way. Sami "MacInnis" Salo and Matty Ohlund are so underrated someone should really press charges cuase these guys are gettin robbed of cridt due them.

The only complaint you can have about the Dynamic Duo that is the Sedin Twins is that they make it all look too easy! They do stuff regularly that players would injure themselves critically just dreamin about doing.

I could go on of course but hell, just watch this team for a few games and you'll see I'm right. They're bound to take the Division handily and find themselves heftin some heavy hardware in the form of a big ole champagne sipper once weather has warmed up again as this team won't cool off until they get the job done. You can take that to the bank.

Canucks=Cup believe dat fo sho

Minty, you changed your logo to a Nucks one??? Where is your support for the Hawks?

About your post, well... for sure, Vancouver has a really good team this year, succeeding at least to have a real #1 goalie. They will be a huge danger for everyone. But they are not the only big team. Even in their division, they'll be challenged i think. Of course, Colorado and especially Calgary had a really bad start, but i'm sure they'll be back to the top. And don't forget Buffalo, in the East, who has an incredible start and a very well balanced team, even if i have some doubts about their capacity to win the Cup.

So yes, the Nukcs have what's needed to be strong all over the season, but they are not alone in this case, so there's still a big competition between teams. And well, even if i don't wish it to them, their team should be destroyed by injuries, like every team. And every team has a bad run somewhere in the season... If it occurs in the playoffs, it's holidays at once.

And who knows, maybe the Pittsburgh Babies will win it all! I don't think so, but won't be over-surprised if they do so...

Buffalo's taking it. Fo Shezzy.

Bravo Minty! I hope the Nucks win their first cup this year as well. Wouldnt that be something for Luongo!

The thing is, last night's 5-0 victory over the Hawks was partly due to the fact the Hawks are under some very heavy injury bug attack. No disrespect Minty, but the team without their top 2 forwards and their star goaltender....last night they looked like a very good AHL team. Again, no offence.

If the Nucks cant win by at least 2-3 goals last night, then they really should be worried. There are still some obsticles standing between the Nucks and the Cup. Vancouver is in the hardest division to play in the NHL right now. The worst team in the division is Calgary...that should say something. Not to mention the Nucks are doing particularly bad against division rivals.

Its good to see Pyatt is clicking with the twins, but Jan Bulis...I think he was benched by Vingualt for the entire 3rd period last night. Bulis needs to show he can stick with the big line or he might find himself out of work next year.

There's lots of teams better then the Canucks right now, but hey you might be right Minty since Carolina was predicted as the bottom dweller last year, and in the new NHL anyteam can have a chance at the cup (that is if their healthy of course). Go Canucks Go!!

Minstrel? MInstrel? Did they make you drink that stuff? Are you okay?

Now seriously the Canucks are a strong team this season. Colorado sucks (sorry Shadd they suck bad), Calgary looks terrible, well more like they are actually breathing since Sutter is not behind the bench, and Edmonton...nah. Minnesota is strong, and will be the battle this season for the division.
Canucks are coming on strong. Not sure if Cup strong. But they are playing amazing hard working hockey. I have seen Naslund hit people, and backcheck to the point where he is sliding into Luongo and scaring the rubbish out of the entire Canucks fanbase as they lie on the ice. Who would have thunk it?

Sabres,,,they is fast, they is quick...but we got PYATT. (and Fitzpatrick grumble)

I may have spoken too soon on Krapicek. That boy can skate, and he can move the puck. Hmm.
But Canucks Minty? Stanley Cup? You sure? What makes you think that?

batdad wrote:Colorado sucks (sorry Shadd they suck bad)

Theodore...Sakic...Svatos...Hejduk...and others... There are some things to do with that,no? However, i don't if they good or bad, i'll hate them the same way until they go back to Quebec, because according to me it's a shame that such a great hockey-lover city like Quebec has no NHL team due to the fact that a desertic land has more bucks!

batdad wrote:Calgary looks terrible

I agree! Even if i'm a bit concerned about their start... but well, they had 4 straight games on the row... that could explain such a bad start. But i'm sure they'll soon be back and haunt everyone in the northwest division. And they also are one of my favorites for the title. But as i'm a fan, i don't know if i over-evaluate them or not. I don't think so, though...

And well... Nucks can win this year, they have the team to do so. But they are not the only ones, so i won't be as affirmative as Minty. They have the potential to become champions...like other teams...

Theodore is brutal. He should go find Paris Hilton again. Check my hockey pool stats. They have no defense. Hejduk is okay, Svatos and Wolski are kids. In 3 years those two will be amazing, but neither is going to make that team the best out there just yet. Especially when Liles, Van Aanen are the top defense. That is trouble personified.
That leaves my best friend and mortal enemy as a child...Mr Sakic. Yeah, he is a god. I will admit it. But a 37 year old god like me. Yes it is a shame there is no team in Quebec City, but life goes on.

Calgary is slap happy. No yelling, no screaming, and they think it is a playground. The Wild and Oilers are the competition for Van. I still do not believe either of those teams have goaltending though. Roloson is known as the "accidental goalie" and Fernandez has proven nothing in big games or playoffs on his own without being platooned. So the division should belong to Van if they continue this hard work. The Cup though? Not so sure.

First of all, unless you're the 9-0 Sabres or the 2-8 Coyotes it's too early to judge a team, so keep your pants on Canucks fans. Second of all, Calgary started 4-7-1 last year in October. They proceeded to win the division, go 38-4 at home and allow the fewest goals of any team in the league. So say what you want about them being naff out of the gate, a REAL Flames fan doesn't get worried about it.

Colorado DOES suck. Theodore is awful. This is what happens when everyone thinks you're Superman after one season. Does anyone remember Jim Carey (not the actor)?

Minnesota has proven themselves the team to beat in the early part of the season as far as the NW division is concerned. They're fast, they can now score and they have the same work ethic/defensive shutdown system inherent in a Jacques Lemaire team.

The Oilers are the Oilers and will not be able to sustain their momentum all season, especially as Roloson begins to choke, having never shouldered the full starter role before. Just because you score five goals a game doesn't mean you get an extra two points, Oilers fans.

Now Vancouver. I hate Dave Nonis. A lot. Luongo is NOT worth 7 million. What has he done to earn it? Show middle of the pack save % numbers last season and again fail to backstop a maturing team to a winning season? VERY impressive Roberto. If this guy was as good as people seem to think he is, the Panthers would've made some noise in the last few years. I know guys, "he's seeing forty shots a night!" Well, not only does he say that's the way he likes it, I again refer you to his generally average save % numbers (which is the only truly accurate measure of his skill considering the amount of shots) except for that one year he was up for Vezina contention. A truly great goaltender wins games for his team. Period. I hear a TON of "the Flames are a bunch of AHLers and Miikka Kiprusoff". True or not, if you want to tell me that the Flames lack talent, you have to concede that Kipper's doing it all, and therefore a great goalie gets teams to the playoffs on his own. Then the defense. Vancouver's defense is NOTHING like the veteran defense Carolina had last season. People who know hockey know Glen Wesley and Aaron Ward and Bret Hedican (and even Mike Commodore) and know that they're reliable, solid defensemen. They were called 'no-names' because they're not big time stars and they're not big time stars because you don't notice them. You don't notice them because they're good defensemen playing the position in a simple, effective way. Now I fully agree that Ohlund and Salo are underrated (I took Ohlund as my second pick in the fantasy draft challenge I have so much respect for his game). But who else ya got? Willie Mitchell? I'll believe it when I see it. Luc Bourdon won't last the full year in the NHL. Krajicek will be lucky to himself the way he's played. I do like Kevin Bieksa but he still needs time to develop. Two great players plus a bunch of young guys that don't look like they know what they're doing on the ice is not the same as a defensive corps comprised of veterans who play mistake-free hockey.

I could go on.

I always point out Jim Carey when speaking of Theodore too His career basically ended when he stepped down off a curb and broke his ankle I think it was... Theodore has looked BuhRUUtal the majority of the time and I bet we keeps praying he will wake up and go to practive the next day and see that he has Rob Blake back. I'm suprised what a non-issue has been made of that' that's a massive loss for Colorado. I still contend they would have been better off just pumping up Abby sayign he was the man and hoping he'd go out and play like it. That trade was horrific. Speaking of horrific I also caught the Edmonton game last night and don't think i've seen a goaltender look much more average than Rolly did in that one, it was pretty darn embarrasing actually, he probably has tan lines on his neck from the red light comin on behind him so often!

But back to my Canucks because THAT is what this is all about baby!!! Hey, say I'm drinking the Kool Aide if ya want but if you look back at my prior messages you'll see I've been a 'Nucks fan following them as "the team I wished my home team played more like" for years. Yeah the Hawks are making progress but they are a team built for the future and with the injuries it looks like another year at least will be have to be passed before that can happen. The Canucks can win now though.

Speaking of Calgary I've always thought they were the most overrated team in ohhh I dunno maybe a few decades? They won't even sniff the playoffs let alone get back to make another run. Sutter isn't there to personally kick everyone's ass just when they need it to get them to come out on top of all those one goal games they keep playing. Also they were the ultimate hock and hold and clutch and grab team of all time. And if they weren't overrated enough as it was they bring in Tanqueray as The Answer to their innate lack of goal scoring? And you say that Luongo isn't worth the money?? At least his stats were all his own and impressive considering that he was relied on to stop 60 shots a night to give Florida even a fighting chance. What has Tanqueray done? Beside be fortunate enough to land on a line with BOTH Joe Sakic AND Peter Forsberg at one point in his stat padding career? He's a glorified Mike Knuble! Even Iginla could score with the linemates the green glass player has had the fortune of lining up with. But if you want to go back to goalies maybe Kipper should give Luongo a call because he looks so very very ordinary this year.

So, no, I don't see anyone challenging the Canucks.

Okay okay... all those comments, analysis and predictions are very interesting, but totally useless actually... The answer is in June, not before... And a surprise in playoffs is always possible... Just remember last year's Western Conference 1st round to be sure of it...

Debates about whose team is the best are never useless. Especially when Flame fans consistently lose the debates. Both on paper, and ice.

However, that being said. The Flames are not a horrible team, they are just not a good one either. Fair to middlin'. Yep one good playoff run, one good regular season. That is it. And yeah, it may be more than the previous version of the Canucks did, but I suggest everyone watch the way the Canucks play closely. Defense plus Offense...and goaltending. (Anyone ever see how Luongo did in the World Cup semi final when Brodeur got hurt, under thousands of pounds of pressure? Oh yeah, right he was amazing!) The pressure and hustle..the skating..it is the way of the future. Now if those dumbass whale jerseys would only go away. If Cooke and Mo stop taking stupid hooking penalties...
On to the Flames: Calgary has a team that plays a style that reminds me alot of the Dallas Stars cup winning team. 1 man in 4 at the blueline. Then when the 1 man gets beat, 4 at the Flames blue line. Dump out, dump in. Bob Cole should call Flames games. Dull, sleepy, golf like affairs. Don't need to know the players' names. Who coached those Stars? Oh yeah, that guy Philly fired because he is a dinosaur, and does not get how the game needs to be played now.
At least watching the Oilers (my 2nd most hated team) is not like watching paint dry. Calgary had some success with rubbish hockey, but if even Lemaire is playing some fire wagon stuff...The Flames? No hope. They need to get with the program or Sutter/Playfair will end up in the same spots as Clarke/Hitchcock.

Some pretty big statements made, gentlemen. Pretty big.

"Fair to middlin'. Yep one good playoff run, one good regular season. That is it." - Batdad

One GREAT playoff run and one GREAT regular season. Making the 7th game of the Cup Final is not just "good" and neither is winning the most competitive division in hockey. Keep in mind that Sutter has been running things for only 2 full seasons, one of which was the Cup run and the other was the NW division title season. I have no delusions about how naff we were before that (but I was still at the Saddledome every other night, so don't call me a bandwagoner at any point. Not that anyone has, I'm just saying ahead of time).

"Anyone ever see how Luongo did in the World Cup semi final when Brodeur got hurt, under thousands of pounds of pressure? Oh yeah, right he was amazing!" - Batdad

I remember that and Luongo terrified me. Every shot I thought he was going to let squeeze through him he looked so awkward controlling rebounds and absorbing pucks. He got the job done and good for him but he certainly didn't impress me.

"On to the Flames: Calgary has a team that plays a style that reminds me alot of the Dallas Stars cup winning team. 1 man in 4 at the blueline. Then when the 1 man gets beat, 4 at the Flames blue line. Dump out, dump in." - Batdad

How closely do you watch the Flames? I'm not going to try to argue that they play an exciting offensive brand of hockey (when they try to they lose, recent trip through Toronto and Montreal case in point) but they work hard for the puck in all three zones and are always physical (who doesn't enjoy watching Dion Phaneuf level a Sean Avery or beat up a Bill Guerin?). What's more exciting than winning? The Flames don't care about putting on a show for anybody and the fans don't care if they get one or not, they want to see the team win. Call them boring all you want, it's not going to bother a real Flames fan.

"Calgary had some success with rubbish hockey, but if even Lemaire is playing some fire wagon stuff...The Flames? No hope. They need to get with the program or Sutter/Playfair will end up in the same spots as Clarke/Hitchcock" - Batdad

Calgary's played a really clean game so far as far as obstruction goes. Compared to Vancouver anyhow. The Flames are 12th in PIM and the Canucks are 4th. I'll let the stats speak for themselves. Get with what program? I'm amazed at the short memories of some people. Calgary started 4-7-1 last season in October. They finished 3rd overall in the conference. What program is there to get with? The winning early then tanking down the stretch program that the Canucks subscribe to? Meanwhile, Clarke and Hitchcock have spent years in Philly and every year was supposed to be a championship year. Same story with Brian Burke and Marc Crawford. If Sutter/and Playfair go another four or five years without converting, they're justifiably out but their regime has just begun, Sutter has brought nothing but success, and it's much too early to say anything about Playfair. They're not going anywhere, with or without "the program".

"Speaking of Calgary I've always thought they were the most overrated team in ohhh I dunno maybe a few decades? They won't even sniff the playoffs let alone get back to make another run." - Minstrel

Overrated? Like 03-04's Canucks? That was supposed to be the year for them if I recall. Or overrated like the Penguins before last season? Weren't they supposed to challenge for the Cup? At least the Flames held a winning record. If anything I thought they got LESS respect last season until they proved themselves because so many people expected another Anaheim (03) or Carolina (02) or Buffalo (99) or Washington (98) or Florida (96). They made it back to the playoffs so it's hard to call them pretenders.

"And if they weren't overrated enough as it was they bring in Tanqueray as The Answer to their innate lack of goal scoring? And you say that Luongo isn't worth the money?? At least his stats were all his own and impressive considering that he was relied on to stop 60 shots a night to give Florida even a fighting chance. What has Tanqueray done? Beside be fortunate enough to land on a line with BOTH Joe Sakic AND Peter Forsberg at one point in his stat padding career?" - Minstrel

Tanguay is getting better but he's obviously not the player Flames fans hoped he'd be so far. I do think that his contract was offered too early and for too long but that's the only way Sutter could sign him. More importantly, he spent pretty much all of last season on a line with Ian LaPerriere and Brett Clark. Look at THEIR stats and we'll ask ourselves who's being inflated by whom. One more time. If Luongo were that great, he'd have taken the Panthers to AT LEAST a winning season.

"Even Iginla could score with the linemates the green glass player has had the fortune of lining up with."

I really hope you're not cracking on Jarome. Not that I would do anything about it Jarome is a true leader, he wins faceoffs, he plays (very well) on the PK, he's a two-time Richard winner and (seriously) an excellent human being. His production might have been down last year but I'll refer you to a guy called Steve Yzerman who scored over 100 points a season for a losing Red Wings club until some nobody coach Scotty Bowman got him playing a more defensive role. Yzerman's point totals dropped significantly, but the team started to win. Winning is what matters to Jarome, not goals. If he has to be the guy to score them he will (he pretty much single-handedly took the Flames to game 7 against the Ducks, I admit that the guys were tremendously lackluster once Bryzgalov started to frustrate them a little bit), but the team always comes first with Jarome.

"maybe Kipper should give Luongo a call because he looks so very very ordinary this year." - Minstrel

Maybe. Or maybe I'll bring up, one more time, the Flames (and Kipper's) weak opening last year. Then I'll mention that Kiprusoff went on from a 4-7-1 start to win 8 in a row and lead the league in GAA and shutouts, place second in wins and third in save % before taking home the Vezina and the Jennings. He looked pretty bad the first few games last year too, is what I'm saying.

Call the Flames mediocre all you want. We'll see you at the end of the year.

Tanguay is getting better but he's obviously not the player Flames fans hoped he'd be so far

This statement says it all. You (meaning Flames fans not you personally, although not sure what you thought at the time of the deal) thought you were getting a 150 point man when he plays with Iginla, without even looking at the fact that his entire career has been spent playing beside 2 superstars (Forsberg, Sakic, Hejduk, Blake--2 of those 4 on the ice with him virtually every time he hit it). With Jarome and whoever...not gonna happen. Not now, not ever.

I also particularly love the question "How closely do you watch the Flames?"... The defensive arguement always used. Did anyone say they always watch the Flames, or they never watch the Flames? Nope. I could easily turn that arguement about the Canucks to you, but I do not. Know why...cause I know you could not watch them as much as I have. But that does not make me the god of all Canucks knowledge. Read my earlier posts about Krapicek. I call him horrid, and the Canucks are nuts about how he is playing lights out.
Anyway, never said the Canucks would win the cup. In fact, made fun of Minstrel for it. Yep, did say the Flames will not. Nor the Oilers, nor the Av's and likely not the Wild. But that is because they all suck...Go watch the Sabres. and do not give me it is early yet. Sorry, but Calgary stumbled out of the blocks last season, and guess what..they stumbled at the end too!

"without even looking at the fact that his entire career has been spent playing beside 2 superstars (Forsberg, Sakic, Hejduk, Blake--2 of those 4 on the ice with him virtually every time he hit it)"

I'll refer you to the part when I mentioned his linemates last season. I don't think anyone can describe Ian Laperriere or Brett Clark as 'superstars'. I'm not saying he hasn't enjoyed his time with the greats but to say that's the only reason he's had success means you're not paying attention.

"Know why...cause I know you could not watch them as much as I have."

You'd be surprised. From 2002-2004 I lived in Vancouver and watched a lot of Canucks hockey. I still watch a lot of Canucks hockey, mostly because I love watching hockey period and the Canucks are a team I know pretty well. Same with the Oilers--I hate them passionately but I watch their games quite often and cheer against them and get to know how they work. The Canucks new system IS working out pretty well for them. Guys like Morrison and Cooke and Kesler fit naturally into more defensive roles and the Sedins are maturing into true stars to take care of a lot of the offense. Getting rid of Bertuzzi was definitely the right call as well. Still, if you're going to play tight defensive hockey, it helps to have a good defense (again, not to detract from Ohlund, who's the nuckers, and Salo).

"Go watch the Sabres. and do not give me it is early yet."

I FULLY agree with you there. I'll also refer you to the earlier post in which I said "unless you're the 9-0 Sabres it's too early to judge" or something to that effect. They are pretty much EXACTLY what the new NHL is supposed to be about and would already be champions if not for the injuries last season.

"Sorry, but Calgary stumbled out of the blocks last season, and guess what..they stumbled at the end too!"

Yeah, they sure did. I can't really argue with that, can I? I can point out that the Canucks didn't even make the playoffs but I don't' think that's really the point, is it? I refer to Calgary's poor start last season so often because the detractors and nay-sayers are constant about how mediocre the Flames have looked so far, ignoring the similar start last year and the ultimate results. Basically I'm saying that a 3-4-1 record doesn't bother me. If it gets to 13-14-1 then we have a problem, but that remains to be seen. I don't hold any delusions about the Flames winning the Cup this year. I think it's within the realm of possibility if every player contributes and plays their best hockey but the same could be said for just about every team in the NHL. The Flames might have aspects that can make it easier for them to do so, but early season prediction here: Ducks v. Sabres for the Cup.

Canucks, Buffalo and Minnesota... Come on, be realistic. Philly will win the cup this year!

I think the Ducks will be there or there about. I ain't saying we'll win it but can definetly see us matching last seasons conference final and we have solid goaltending and defence. Forward wise we are still a bit inexperienced but have youth on our side in the most part. The main thing is to keep injury free get enough wins at home and be able to pick up a point away even if we play badly.

I think we can get to the final tho I think Atlanta could be in with a shout. Buffalo I think will have a great regular season but may get pipped by Atlanta somewhere along the play off line.

Final prediction: Ducks v Thrashers

The Ducks have a solid team.

I would take them over the Canucks to win the Cup.

That being said, I would take Buffalo over both of them.

Don't count out the 'Canes. We started out slow, but we are getting it together healthwise so watch out.

So much avs hate here heh, and while I have no illusion of winning the cup this year, I think "suck" is too harsh all things considered. Been enjoying watching Wolski and Stastny show alot of promise, combined with Liles being a ppg dman atm. When Leopold gets back it should be a huge boost for the d in generel, but when arnason is producing things cant be all bad heh, so the avs have a fair shot of making the playoffs imo.
People were writing of the avs last season as well, but they still made it to the second round heh.

Havent seen canucks play this season apart from a few highlights, but looking at their roster it strikes me, that they lack scoring depth?. As I understand nucks are very close to the cap, so not much room for a big trade even at the deadline right?.

Not much hate for the Av's from me really. Just being honest about there chances. Canucks? Lack scoring depth? Yeah, I suppose maybe. But all teams have a weakness, and if Mr. Luongo keeps them in the games the way he has so far all season. Maybe not a big deal.

Hey Minty...time to weigh in for you. Honestly.

I like Vancouver; I started watching them in the Crawford era because I respected their style of play. They are still a team I keep up with and gladly will tune in to.

However, yes, this debate is largely batdad's not mine We had a little wager on the Vancouver vs. Chicago game that the other would praise the victor as the sure fire Cup winner this year and change to their "support logo" in the forum for a week.

My points originally beside the parts where I say they will definitely win the Cup stand though just not as emphatically.

My comments about the Flames though were from the heart as it were, I really do think they are a grossly overrated team and without Sutter constantly on their asses it will show this year. Watching the freakin Red Wings of all teams just make them look foolish yesterday did nothing to instill any confidence in me that they will be able to score or that Kipper is a god; he let in to verrrrry average goals and didn't seem to be playing with any confidence.

I think that much like Marty Turco two years ago and if you want to go back to Ed Belfour when he won the cup behind Dallas' wall of a defense he is merely a quality goalie that has had an easier job than most. I'd compare him to say Olaf Kolzig who is a quality goalie who doesn't play behind a defensively oriented team with a giant defensive corps and some nights he can be the difference and others he can just get killed. Even doing that is a victory really. That's the level I put Kipper on. A goalie any team would like to have. He isn't however the best in the league nor will he be remembered as one of the greats.

Change "goalie" to "captain" and the previous two statements also apply to Jerome Iginla and for that matter Mike Modano if you want to keep up the Flames-Dallas comparisons. Both are highly overrated players with great skills anyone would love on their team but they get far too much credit as players that can do no wrong and are the best in the game than they deserve. Leaders make other players better, take Joe Sakic and Steve Yzerman as examples. Neither Iginla or Modano have been able to do that and until they do they will not in my mind be among the greats, just in the top level of talent in the league.

Cept I did not think the Canucks would win the cup. Never have, never will. Until it happens. Just thought the wager would be some fun. And people got mad at me. Oh so much fun.

I figured I'd wait a couple games before I responded to criticism of Kipper in the Red Wings game....First of all, the "Red Wings of all teams"? Which Red Wings team have you been watching the last ten-odd years? And yeah, Kipper wasn't spectacular that game but he held the Flames in it when they were being outclassed severely in nearly every other aspect. They hung in, down only a goal, right to the end.

More importantly, Kipper's back. 3 games, 3 goals, one shutout against the best team in hockey who had just set a record for most consecutive games without a regulation loss. A team that chased Roberto Luongo out of the net the night before after scoring 3 goals on 9 shots (I know, I know, the defense. Still. 3 goals, 9 shots). They took 37 shots but had no more than a handful of true chances as the Flames showed their defensive prowess, and when there WAS a strong chance, Kipper was there every time.

Three seasons in a row now, the Flames are written off by the first month as 'average' or 'mediocre'. They're not out of the woods yet this season but they're taking big steps in the right direction beating powerhouses Dallas and Anaheim in consecutive games.

"Of all teams" I said at the time because they'd at that point scored about 5 goals in 8 games and everyone was talking about the teams lack of goalscoring almost as much as the Flames... but in that game the Wings didn't seem to be having any problems getting 'em past Kipper.

It's good that he's picked it up recently because that's what the Flames need along with Iginla scoring at least a goal per game too because unless they do they have little if any chance at making the playoffs let alone contending for the Cup.

I can't argue with that! I do think the Flames can manage a winning record with McLennan (they've done it before) or Krahn, who I would expect to start were Kipper to go down for any length of time. Their system works, for the first few games of the season they just weren't playing it. Matthew Lombardi is starting to come on, he's working well with Tanguay. When those two really click and Kobasew stops fighting the puck they're going to be a fun line to watch. Amonte has been hot lately too but I don't see that continuing. His value to the team is so much greater than simply scoring goals...he's become one of our best defensive forwards and that's saying a lot. Still, you're right, if Iggy isn't scoring and Kipper isn't back there the Flames can only make it so far.

You're officially "preaching to the choir" telling me about Amonte; I love the guy! Were it not for him giving about 300% effort every darn night here in Chicago fo so many years it would have been even darker days around here for Hawks fans.