Getting a player to gain weight?

[tmratlif]

So is there a way that I can train a player to add weight? Did a search and didn't see anything about this. i know I can edit this with the saved game editor but I am hoping there is a way in the game that I can use to get this result. I was thinking maybe strengh played a factor in this but so far I have not seen a change in a players weight even when strengh is increased.

[pinheirobcp]

I'm not 100% sure, but size and weight are merely cosmetical, no?

Attributes like Strength, Balance, Agility handle how "big" a guy plays.

I know it doesn't answer your question, but still...

[nino33]

size and weight are merely cosmetical, no?

Apparently the developers didn't intend on it, but users quickly showed that size (weight) can make a difference (especially when it comes to hitting/strength).

is there a way that I can train a player to add weight?

As part of the process of developing the 1974 db I have done extensive testing on Height/Weight development, and I've determined
- 99.9% of any Height/Weight gain actually occurs at game start-up, and only occurs for players under age 21
- This "initial" Height/Weight gain is the only Height/Weight gain that occurs
- The amount of Height/Weight gain is variable each time you start a new game (same player, each new game will produce new/different results)

For example Taylor Hall is in the Pre-Game editor HT 180 WT 74 (UUDB 5.0)
- first test Hall was 187 - 84 at game start-up
- second test Hall was 185 - 87 at game start-up
- third test Hall was 185 - 96 at game start-up
In all tests Hall's initial Height/Weight gain was the only gain he had (the very rare player [less than 1%] has some small growth occur in their second year).

So ultimaely the answer to your question is no, there's nothing you can do about Weight

Regards

[pinheirobcp]

size and weight are merely cosmetical, no?

Apparently the developers didn't intend on it, but users quickly showed that size (weight) can make a difference (especially when it comes to hitting/strength).

I honestly never experienced this king of effect...

I've had players who were 5-8 but had amazing physical attributes and were hitting/physical plays machines, but 6-6 mammoths who couldn't hit my grandma.

I would like to see how this conclusion came to pass. Not doubting it, though. I said it was cosmetic off-hand, because I'm pretty sure it used to be just for show in the CM/FM series.

[nino33]

I've never done any real testing on the EFFECT of weight myself....I said "apparently" because my comments were based on what I read (and those comments I read were 4-5 years old)

I searched the Gameplay Forum just now and there are comments from users on this issue from years ago, seemingly concluding that Strength had an effect and Strength was influenced by Weight

I've had players who were 5-8 but had amazing physical attributes and were hitting/physical plays machines, but 6-6 mammoths who couldn't hit my grandma.

Hmmmm...I wonder if the "amazing physical attributes" had something to do with the succcess of the smaller player? To actually "compare" the effect of their different sizes wouldn't their other attributes have to be pretty close to the same? (and you'd have to have icetime/linemates/etc be the same) Because if the bigger player lacks things like acceleration/balance/positioning then he won't be an effective hitter (he won't be effective at much!)

Regards

[pinheirobcp]

Hmmmm...I wonder if the "amazing physical attributes" had something to do with the succcess of the smaller player? To actually "compare" the effect of their different sizes wouldn't their other attributes have to be pretty close to the same? (and you'd have to have icetime/linemates/etc be the same) Because if the bigger player lacks things like acceleration/balance/positioning then he won't be an effective hitter (he won't be effective at much!)

Regards

Well, duh... What I meant is that I've seen players with similar height/weight and fairly different physical attributes have fairly different results, and players with similar physical attributes and very different height/weight have the same fairly different results.

Also, if it has any effect at all, the extremes would provide extreme results, so small players should be bad/average at whatever height/weight influences, even if they have good physical attributes, and the opposite for very big players.

If it has any effect at all, it's slim. But anyway, this is all guess work and off-memory. Worthless as a valid argument.

[batdad]

A player who is 6'4 and 220 is going to do as well as a 5.9 185lb player if his attributes are lower, and he is used in the correct manner. It is not necessarily the height and weight. Ratings may be higher for a hitter than a player who is not. In my Stars challenge, Matt Fraser was a hitting beast. He would score 12 points in a season with 15 minutes of ice time, but he would invariably lead the team in hits, and his average rating would be 7. On the other hand, even set to berserk and huge hitting...Steve Ott...a slightly smaller player (height smaller, weight bigger than Fraser) would not fare well. His hits were few and far between with the same ice time, and set to hit more. His average rating, even though he scored on the same pace as Fraser was always between 6-6.5. Fraser stayed above 7 right from his rookie season. Ott did not.

So...weight? I don't think so. Attitude-team play yes. Weight not so sure.

Some guys have success with small guys, some guys do not. Depends on how their tactics are designed. Matt Fraser was the biggest surprise to me. His attributes were not very good, and did not get better.But he played a role VERY well. Ott...not so much.

[timmy_t]

To answer your original question about getting a player to gain weight, they naturally gain weight until they are 22 years old. After that you are stuck with them.

For the second part that everyone is talking about, weight and performance, I did research and posted about weight and hitting and determined that weight absolutely influences hitting and the end result is higher ratings.

There are plenty of examples of players that weigh more dominating the game. Just look at Olli Jokinen or Nik Antropov.

[whatwasthat]

To answer your original question about getting a player to gain weight, they naturally gain weight until they are 22 years old. After that you are stuck with them.

For the second part that everyone is talking about, weight and performance, I did research and posted about weight and hitting and determined that weight absolutely influences hitting and the end result is higher ratings.

There are plenty of examples of players that weigh more dominating the game. Just look at Olli Jokinen or Nik Antropov.

Or Zdeno Chára . It would have been amazing if we had more control of a players diet, scolding them when they come back from an off-season still at the same fitness level without any gains

[pinheirobcp]

Maybe i'm beeing skeptical, but doesn't Chara, Jokinen and Antropov have very good physical/mental attributes to go along with their height/weight? Maybe that's why they perform better? I don't know...

[batdad]

timmy--Although I agree that the height and weight do play some role...size always does..it is not the sole determining factor in what makes a player play well. It helps sure, but the skating, and the attributes all help. Antropov is no longer dominant in the game as we have put him down the peg or two he needs to be put down as the databases have been adjusted. Same for Oli, same for Brendan Morrow. Big strong players do well...but not the ONLY factor.

Like Fraser...they may get high game ratings because they are big and strong and hit. But if they do nothing else they are not that valuable. Sometimes a guy who scores every game (Alex Burrows, Duncan Keith) but still only averages 7, is better than a guy who hits 10 times, goes -1 and does not score, but averages 7.5 (matt Fraser).

[nino33]

they naturally gain weight until they are 22 years old. After that you are stuck with them

My testing (125 players, 3 tests of 12+ years each) showed players under age 21 "unnaturally" grow at game start-up and that's it...they don't grow over time

I did research and posted about weight and hitting and determined that weight absolutely influences hitting and the end result is higher ratings.

Although I agree that the height and weight do play some role...size always does..it is not the sole determining factor in what makes a player play well

I don't think timmy_t ever said it was "the sole determing factor" (I think he was trying to rebute pinheirobcp, who stated size is just cosmetic and has no effect); I think I recall seeing timmy_t's post/data...not sure it was reposted when the site upgraded


Regards

[tmratlif]

Well that is what I thought and that disappoints me seeing how I thought I had found that true diamond in the 7th round. I found a RD that has very nice attributes yet is only 171 lbs at 19 years old. Least there is interest in him around the league I should have no trouble stealing a high draft pick from some team. Thanks for the responses guys.

[nino33]

Well that is what I thought and that disappoints me seeing how I thought I had found that true diamond in the 7th round. I found a RD that has very nice attributes yet is only 171 lbs at 19 years old. Least there is interest in him around the league I should have no trouble stealing a high draft pick from some team. Thanks for the responses guys.

Hmmmmmm....it just occured to me that ALL of my testing was from the start of a brand new game, NOT with players who were "created" by the game (regens)....so if your 7th round pick is not in the Pre-game Editor, he is a "created by the game" player - perhaps they "grow" differently? If you think of it maybe you could check his size at the start of the next season...

Regards

[tmratlif]

Well that is what I thought and that disappoints me seeing how I thought I had found that true diamond in the 7th round. I found a RD that has very nice attributes yet is only 171 lbs at 19 years old. Least there is interest in him around the league I should have no trouble stealing a high draft pick from some team. Thanks for the responses guys.

Hmmmmmm....it just occured to me that ALL of my testing was from the start of a brand new game, NOT with players who were "created" by the game (regens)....so if your 7th round pick is not in the Pre-game Editor, he is a "created by the game" player - perhaps they "grow" differently? If you think of it maybe you could check his size at the start of the next season...

Regards

Just before the start of camp in his 2nd year he is 174. He might have been that the previous season now I am not sure. For some reason 171 is in my mind. Not to say there aren't people in the world like this but at 6'6" the kid should be heavier than 174.