Official NHL Off-Season Thread 2011

[Malone_is_AmericanFinesse]

Context of the trade sale of Gretzky

It's not very comparable to even come up with Gretzky/Crosby trade value. No matter what, the team that gets Crosby wins, especially in the salary cap era. The long-term effect of the deal would be disastrous, even if the very short term proved to be okay.

It's important to understand the Oilers (under Pocklington) were basically forced into "selling" Gretzky because Pocklington needed the cash essentially. I believe the original deal was going to be essentially - Gretzky (and I believe McSorley and Krushelnyski, at Gretzky's request) for $15 million (in 1988 money). It wasn't until Glen Sather got involved that it actually started to look like a hockey deal. Though they fell short of getting their top prize, young winger Luc Robitaille, they garnered Jimmy Carson (who was supposed to be awesome, just like Barry Pederson was), Martin Gelinas and a bushel of first round picks. And of course the $15 million needed to get Pocklington out of some hot soup.

While it will always have Pocklington hated by Edmonton fans, he was also the only reason why the Oilers got to enjoy Gretzky's prime. Gretzky was signed by Indianapolis (WHA), but more specifically, by a man named Nelson Skalbania. The deal wasn't really with Indianapolis at all, for all intents and purposes, it was with Skalbania (a personal services contract). It was clear Indianapolis was going to fail (they lost tens of thousands of dollars a game, at points) and he was going to be sold to Winnipeg or Edmonton - it was Pocklington who ponied up about $800,000 to buy him and sign a new 10-year (with options for 10 more years) personal services contract that probably went fairly far to keeping Gretzky in Edmonton through the WHA/NHL merger in which the WHA clubs were raped and pillaged. The clubs were only allowed to keep a couple players, but I don't believe Gretzky's contract was with Edmonton specifically, it was with Pocklington. When all the WHA contracts were wiped, Gretzky was unaffected and wasn't a part of the dispersal draft (unlike third rounder Mark Messier for instance) and hence, wasn't selected or else he would have been a Winnipeg Jet in all likelihood.

Interesting side note, I think it was Sam Pollock (the famed Montreal GM) that had the forethought to try to acquire a high first round pick in and around this time, thinking that Gretzky would be available! Could you imagine if Gretzky stepped into the shoes of Jean Beliveau. "Gretzky to Lafleur...scores!" And then by 1986, the two best "money" players in history, Gretzky and Roy, on the same team. Amazing how history might have changed had Pocklington not gotten that personal services contract in place and kept Gretzky an Oiler. That's too often forgotten.

As for the original topic (sorry for the long tangent), Sidney Crosby. I'm not sure I could even formulate a package that works cap wise. And as a Penguins fan, I don't think I want to even consider it. With the trading of cash eliminated, the "second contract" all but gone, the cap implications would be far too great to really even consider. Even if you get players on entry-level deals and smaller contracts, you won't be able to keep them all cap wise for a long period of time.

Let's say you get 4 or 5 of Hall, Paajarvi, Petry, Lander, Hartikainen, Gagner, Eberle, Smid, Teubert and some firsts. Is it really likely they'll combine to make less than $10 million after a few seasons? I don't think so. General rule of thumb, using 2 or 3 or 4 roster spots to combine to fill the vacancy left by 1 = a loss.

[philou21]

Rick Rypien as been found dead in his home in Alberta. I got not more details for now but I'm sure it is the same thing that killed Boogieman. Rypien had the same problem as him so I will not be surprised.

[eric1985]

Really sad news... Loved watching the ripper in Vancouver.. Was waiting to see him return to fighting in the nhl..They said non-suspicious death so either suicide or accidental at this point... kinda hoping for accidental.. RIP Ripper!!

[Danny]

Local radio said he commited suicide. Not sure how reliable that is. RIP Ripper

[eric1985]

In the Yahoo sports atricle on the nhl page it states "News 1130 in Vancouver is reporting that Rypien took his own life." Still so sad hearing this. My thoughts go out to his family.

[Manimal]

So tragic. RIP Rick. *tap* *tap* *tap*

[philou21]

Suicide? Ahhh darn. It seems he couldn't handle his problems.

[bruins72]

That's a shame. I read that he suffered from depression. RIP.

[timmy_t]

It seems he couldn't handle his problems.

Don't say that philou21. It's not funny at all and I'm rather disappointed that you would say that.

[batdad]

Rypien suffered from severe depression. He has had several long battles with it during his hockey career, where it was apparent his meds stopped working. He did not leave the Canucks, or any other team every time he battled it. He likely overdosed on something, in order to end his life.

This is horrible horrible news. He seemed to be getting things back together after his last battle, and he had just signed with the Jets. He seemed so happy to those around him. I don't know him personally so I won't say anything more.

I am just seriously disgusted by people around the net already making jokes,and already calling it a "non shocker" since he was "clearly on drugs". Yes he was on drugs you idjits. He was on anti-depression meds. And he battled all his life with it, and with what his job was, and with his life.

It freaking sucks.

Regina Pats fans have had a real tough summer. Boogie, now Rypien. Rick was their captain at one point. This guy was close to being another "burrows" like story. Just had to be given the chance. And Heisinger was going to give it to him in Winnipeg.


I am calling for some of Rippers best fights to be posted here..

vs Hal Gill in Montreal, vs Valabik in Atl, vs Stortini, vs Prust in Calgary. Ripper ripped up some guys way way bigger than him. And he could play a bit too. Sad.

[philou21]

Were did you saw that I found this funny? This is a disastrous situation and I hate when someone comes to that to "solves their problems". I'm 100% against suicide and there's truth behind what I'm saying, you can't denied that. If he decided to end his life it's because he was at the point that you can't see an escape with your eyes, like there's a wall at 1 cm from you and you can't see nothing else.

So yes, he couldn't resolved his problems but I don't know much about the rest that's true, how he was feeling or the situation he was in but there is always a way to find help, if you do it soon. I know what I'm talking about because in the past months I got problems like that but I never thought about commiting suicide and now I'm stronger than ever. It may be harsh but commiting suicide to me is for the cowards, when you don't want to fight anymore and you tell to yourself you're gonna end all of this by killing yourself, it's more simple than fighting.

As Batdad said he was a good hockey player in many ways....that McDavid-ing sucks.

[batdad]

Philou--Tough subject to get into. Suicide is not really IMHO "Cowardly".....it is the result of some very very difficult situations and a very deep dark depression illness in this case. Yes..help is available. Yes, Rick was getting help (tons of it in fact) but it was not enough. It is sooooo sad. Horrible. I just cannot see it as being cowardly. I cannot put myself in Rick's shoes, but I highly doubt it was because he was scared to face life. More like he was done with it...at least the way he saw it. Also, would not be surprised if it was another call for help from him that went wrong (accidental overdose or something). Clearly Rick saw no way out of his situation. CLearly noone was able to help show him the way out, where he felt comfortable. Not cowardly, just freaking horrible. Dude ....Rick was ill. Rick was not chicken. Just sick

[philou21]

You have your opinion about that and I got mine. Like you said, it's a tough subject to talk about but my opinion about suicide is an harsh one I admit it but when you got enough of your problems that you kill yourself I'm sorry but I see this as a coward act. Rick was maybe not a chicken on the ice but in a situation like this....you can't know how you will react because in a severe depression you're not yourself anymore when you are in a bad, bad crisis. When the bad moment pass you are wondering how the hell you reacted like that and that you weren't yourself at all. The problem his, the more crisis you do, the more bad those crisis are and each time you make a new one you go deeper and deeper until you do the inevitable.....

PS : I will not edit my post, I can admit that I'm wrong. After reading my post, I can see that I got two opinions who doesn't fit at all. One that I'm saying that suicide is the easiest way to avoids your problems and the second one where I can understand that he could've killed himself....Sorry about that. I withdraw what I said about been a coward. I know what's it like to be in a situation were your mind and your body doesn't respond the way you want to and you are completely lost. You are wondering when everything is going to stop and it's probably at this point that you can see suicide as the only way out, when that crisis is the deeper one. The worse about a crisis like this is that maybe 1 hour later, you could've felt ok and the thought of suicide would'nt have crossed your mind but the worse is already done.

[philou21]

There are new rumors about Sid the Kid. It seems he has stopped his training due to a re-appearance of concussion symptoms. Pat Brisson and Ray Shero denied that news but I really donn't know what to think about that. There's 2 options, it's real and Brisson/Shero are trying to hide it or it's just some rumors.

[philou21]

There's chances that Savard will not play this season. That sucks bad for him if he miss this season, that almost means that his career is over.

Tyutin signed a 6 years/27 millions dollars contract with Columbus.

And just as a funny fact who else than a Newfie to make a nice bump on the Cup?

[philou21]

Wade Belak as been founded in an hotel in Toronto today. Holy rubbish that's the fourth one in a couple of months! Is this a conspiracy or what? He was only 35 years old.

[Danny]

RIP

[bruins72]

I heard Belak was another suicide. Has this been confirmed? Did he have a history of concussions? It seems like all of these guys are "tough guys". I wonder if it's concussions doing this to them? No matter what the cause, it's sad to see another one go. RIP.

[philou21]

It's a suicide. Alot of people are complaining it's the fault of concussions but neither Rypien or Boogaard are dead because of that. Rypien and Belak committed suicide and Boogaard, even if they say it's not a suicide still died from drugs/alcohol mix. This look like a stereotype but it looks like tough guy don't have it easy in life. I'm not sure I want to believe that though, every players in the NHL could be like that, after all, they are all humans like us.

[grits207]

Awful news about Belak. He was one of my favourite players during a his time as a Leaf, tough as nails and seemed like a great guy off the ice.

For what it's worth, I'm pretty sure Belak never missed a single game due to a concussion and there is no evidence whatsoever that his suicide (or Rick Rypien's for that matter) had anything to do with being a fighter.

[philou21]

The NHL was saying after Rypien's death that they have a good aid system for the players and that they don't need to improve it but after Belak's death I'm sure that the NHL doesn't provide enough help for their players. And now alot of players are saying that the NHL don't help at all their players after they finished their career. Brent Sopel even said that the NHL don't care about the players after their career, that they are just a "pieve of meat" for them.

Well I'm sure about one thing, that doesn't help the NHL reputation.

[YZG]

The Winnipeg Jets unveiled their new jerseys:

http://www.nhl.com/ice/gallerylanding.htm?id=23682

I feared they'd be worse than that given the logo, but they certainly aren't exciting either. I find the strong attachment to the military to be somewhat out of place, as well. So far the Jets made the best choice in picking a huge name among the fans, but that's all. The expectations are admittedly unfair given the attachment to the previous team, though. Still, there could have been some red on the uniforms.

- YZG

[pinheirobcp]

I like the two-shades-of-blue setup, but they are really pushing this military attachment way too far.

I mean, presenting the jerseys on a military facility? It's the Air Force hockey team, or what?

[Loosie]

I like the new unis, very sharp in my opinion. Can't wait to see them on the ice.

[bruins72]

I thought they looked pretty decent.