The Official British Hockey Thread 2012-2013

[philou21]

I thought hockey in Finland was more popular that that. The QMJHL have more attendance than this. My local team the Cataractes got an average of 3500-4000 per game and we're a small region, maybe 150 000-200 000 people. The Quebec Remparts got a ridiculous 12 000 to even 15 000 in playoffs. That show that they are missing their NHL team.

[Tasku]

Hockey is the most popular sport in Finland by attendance. No other sport gets even close. But like I said, most teams come from towns that are quite small and wide spread by population. Finland has more land area than the UK, but we have only 5 million people (the UK has 60 million).

[philou21]

You're only 5 millions? Thought Finland was bigger than this in term of population.

[Tasku]

Nope. 5 mil. We have like four of five cities that have more than 100 000 residents.

(Although this has "officially" changed due to many smaller towns and municipalities merging together to save on costs and thus getting bigger by population, while the people living in the city has remained the same. This is a bit misleading if you look at the numbers...)

[grazza]

I'm going to the 2nd leg of Edinburgh v Belfast on Sunday night, Watched the away leg on a webcast and Belfast won 3-1 so it will be tough for Edinburgh but still a lot to play for we did win at home to Belfast just 3 ago, that extra goal Belfast got tonight might just edge it, really hope we score first to make a real battle for it. Elsewhere the two other Scottish clubs in the play offs both won by 2 goals in the home leg of their matches. Braehead beat Cardiff 7-5 so I could see that going all the way maybe OT and penalty shots tomorrow night, Fife were 4-0 up on Nottingham but it finished 4-2, so I think Nottingham will be too good for Fife but still a lot to play for. The new conference system has really boosted the league this season, nearly everyone has something to play for in the final weekend. Would be good to see more teams join as long as they can be competitive. It is quite strange the most built up areas in the UK are in south east England in and around London yet they have never really had much success with pro hockey. London Racers didn't have a proper facility and London Knights were at a time when the docklands area of London was much less prominent and I think having 2 teams would really help a nice rivalry to keep people and local media interested. First off don't name a team London, you ask a Londoner where they are from they are more like to say Chelsea or Hackney, stick to that and concentrate marketing in the local area as there is too much going on in London to really get noticed throughout the city it is like Glasgow, no sports teams have never really been that successful running under the name Glasgow and Braehead is seen as more neutral as it isn't really a place but the name of the shopping centre so rather than calling the team Glasgow or Paisley the Braehead brand is seen as more inclusive to those from all around the West of Scotland.

Fife are a team that have potential to compete in top half their crowds are between about 1500 and 2000 so probably not that far off Coventry. Edinburgh really suffered with the season they had 2 years ago but slowly people are starting to come back and there is real stability Harmann has signed as coach for his 3rd season next year along with Leinweber and hopefully others will sign on too, they have gone down the European route going more for skill and physical hockey, bringing in a couple of north americans mideason though really helped in addition to Jade Portwood who was there from the start of the season. Portwood and Leinweber played college hockey in Alaska and Paltry was top offensvive Dman in France last season and really made a difference from the blueline. Dundee put together a good team this year and very unlucky not to make the play offs, crowds not been great up there but as a city Dundee has more industrial roots and so effected greater than others during the economic downturn but a lot of generation work going on but will take another decade or so to really filter through, the future of the rink was in the news a couple of weeks ago that the operators were facing financial difficulties but hopefully that will get sorted and the council up there have been quite good at help support the facility which is ideal sized for elite hockey. Braehead despite winning their conference (only games between teams in the conference count in the conference table) have had a poor season, possible infighting behind the scenes but they now have a bench coach and if they can keep him then maybe they can get some stability as they have had 4 coaches in 3 years. The guy that assembles the roster needs to be the one in charge of them throughout next season. That said if Braehead get to the final 4 they will get pass marks for this season and anything beyond that it has turned into a good year.



Final Regular Season Table after 52 games

1 Nottingham Panthers 85 (Regular Season Champions 1st seed)
2 Belfast Giants 79 (Erhardt Conference winners 2nd seed)
3 Sheffield Steelers 73 (4th seed)
4 Coventry Blaze 54 (5th seed)
5 Cardiff Devils 50 (6th seed)
6 Edinburgh Capitals 48 (7th seed)
7 Fife Flyers 48 (8th seed)
8 Braehead Clan 46 (Gardner Conference winners 3rd seed)
--------------------------------
9 Dundee Stars 44
10 Hull Stingrays 43

Conference tables (32 matches only taking into account inner-conference scores)

Erhardt Conference
1 Belfast 47
2 Nottingham 47
3 Sheffield 38
4 Coventry 23
5 Cardiff 23

Gardner Conference

1 Braehead 37
2 Fife 36
3 Dundee 35
4 Hull 35
5 Edinburgh 33

[MWE]

Steelers beat Coventry 3-2 with the return game today

[archibalduk]

I'm going to the 2nd leg of Edinburgh v Belfast on Sunday night

Enjoy the game - and best of luck! I'm really rooting for the Scottish teams this weekend. They all made promising starts yesterday. Unfortunately Fife have gone down 0-2 at Nottingham todady - I'd be surprised if Nottingham don't go through now. Not because Fife are weak, but because when Nottingham need a result, the team tends to step up and get it.

I actually think Edinburgh have the best chance of getting through to the semis. Murrayfield is a formidable venue and Belfast haven't been all that convincing for the latter half of the season. I'm not all that sure about Braehead. Yes, they have the lead from yesterday, but their away form is just terrible.

I couldn't agree more with what you say about the conference system. Both conferences are equally as exciting. It has given the Scottish teams something to play for - and the Gardiner Conference games have arguably been the most exciting this season. This is surely great for attracting new fans - and hopefully new imports. I understand that league-wide attendances this season are up from last season. I would have loved to have seen Dundee make the playoffs. For the most part of the season they played extremely well. It was just towards the end of the season things didn't go their way.

It is quite strange the most built up areas in the UK are in south east England in and around London yet they have never really had much success with pro hockey. London Racers didn't have a proper facility and London Knights were at a time when the docklands area of London was much less prominent and I think having 2 teams would really help a nice rivalry to keep people and local media interested. First off don't name a team London, you ask a Londoner where they are from they are more like to say Chelsea or Hackney, stick to that and concentrate marketing in the local area as there is too much going on in London to really get noticed throughout the city it is like Glasgow, no sports teams have never really been that successful running under the name Glasgow and Braehead is seen as more neutral as it isn't really a place but the name of the shopping centre so rather than calling the team Glasgow or Paisley the Braehead brand is seen as more inclusive to those from all around the West of Scotland.

The trend for the southern teams has actually been to go the other way. In recent years we've seen Romford, Chelmsford and Wightlink all drop down from the EPL to the NIHL. A few years before that, Invicta dropped down from the EPL to the NIHL too. The problem is money, pure and simple. Those teams were struggling to afford players at EPL level (with 4 import limit) let alone the 11 that the EIHL has. The situation would be better if there were more British players with EIHL-level talent. At present we have a relatively small number of talented British players. Once these have been snapped up by the teams, the remaining roster spots are filled with EPL and NIHL-level players who aren't really up to scratch. Increasing the number of EIHL teams would exacerbate this, IMO.

I think British hockey is in really good health right now. The EIHL, EPL and NIHL-1 South are exciting and competitive leagues (the NIHL-1 North is a little less competitive IMO - but it has improved with the inclusion of Solway. Apparently Paisley may join next season too).

[archibalduk]

Btw I was at the Slough v MK Lightning game yesterday. MK won 4-2 but it was a pretty closely fought game (and very physical!). The second leg could go either way tonight. My money is on Guildford to win the title. If Manchester hadn't fallen apart at the end of this season then I could see them giving Guildford a run for their money. Unfortunately they're just not playing too well right now - it's hit and miss whether they'll even make it past Bracknell...

[archibalduk]

It looks like Nottingham are going through - unless Fife get a goal in the final 8 mins. Cardiff are now level on aggregate with Braehead.

Coventry are now ahead of Sheffield, but there's plenty of time for Sheffield to turn it around.

[archibalduk]

Urgh it's looking increasingly difficult for Edinburgh to progress.

Heh Manchester are making me eat my words. They're winning 4-0 midway through the game!

[archibalduk]

So the final aggregate scores are (if I've done my maths correctly):

Nottingham 5 - 4 Fife
Cardiff 12 - 7 Braehead
Sheffield 5 - 6 Coventry
Belfast 7 - 4 Edinburgh

Basingstoke 5 - 4 Swindon
Manchester 10 - 6 Bracknell
Milton Keynes 5 - 4 Slough
Guildford 11 - 3 Peterborough

[gazzw87]

I guess where they are lacking is skill level of local players, because foreigners from Canada or other European countries will always want a bigger paycheck than locally raised talent.

Interestingly, the top British players typically earn more than the foreigners. I'm not sure why this is. Perhaps because top UK players are relatively rare - and because once each team has filled their quota of foreigners (11 foreigners per team at the moment), how you fill the remainder of your roster is pretty crucial. Other than the top British players, there is a big gap between the foreigners and the rest of the British players. Hence the stronger teams do well because they take many of the top British players (and therefore have good roster depth) whereas the very weakest teams have to fill their rosters with British players who spend much of their time in the lower leagues.

I don't like how this happens. Yeah they are good so should be paid better but, one it stops teams bringing in better imports and 2 this is partly why Team GB is still so bad! Players like Weaver, Longstaff and co where clearly too worried to go abroad (I know these two did but for what half a season?!) We need our players to go abroad to get better, not eatting up all the money at home! They won't develop at home either.

[archibalduk]

I don't know the details, but I understand the Flyers are unhappy with some goal decisions by the referees. Something about them being denied a goal or two...

[grazza]

So Belfast won tonight 4-3 (with an empty netter). Good effort from Caps though a couple of errors on two of Belfast's goals. Two short handed goals and one powerplay goal for caps so the special teams did well tonight. Still looking forward to my trip to Nottingham next week would have been nice for a Scottish team to finally make the final but only a matter of time surely. Not sure who to route for though with Nottingham being at home and favourites then i'd probably be inclined to cheer the underdogs on but if they play well then fair play they have been as strong as an team I have seen in the elite league era. Cardiff making the final 4 for the 10th year in a row and I think were in the last 3 finals but have never won it. Would be nice to see them have success.

In terms of the player pool the situation Archi describes sounds right enough though I do question if there is enough incentive for there to be an effective production line. With an import limit of 11 or 12 teams can have top 2 lines of imports. The bigger teams can afford better brits so can spread them across the lines and have more depth. I could be wrong but there are probably a dozen or so players in EPL that would be just as good as some in the elite league but these guys being based in the South of England essentially they would need to move, be housed and fed (essentially an import in overheads), that is a massive commitment and if these guys have hit 20 and not hit the grade to be considered for college or minor hockey then realistically ice hockey will not set them up for life so they are reluctant to do it full time then retire with little or no work experience out of hockey or higher education credentials. There are 4 teams in Scotland and 4 in England and England has 10 times the population and 10 relatively southern based semi pro EPL teams (Manchester and Sheffield Steeldogs not so much). Say 2 new Elite teams in England assuming they could attract players from EPL in terms of home grown depth should be at least able to compete with the likes of Dundee, Hull, Edinburgh and Fife if they had imports of comparable standard.So in theory I think there is enough pool but in practice the EPL would weaken if they lost it and they can potentially make more money doing a normal job with a 2nd part time income from hockey. Though to be fair Dundee, Edinburgh and Fife many of the homegrown players are likely to be part time. Another Scottish team say if Aberdeen Oilers joined the league would struggle in terms of getting Scottish players as Dundee, Edinburgh and Fife have most of them, Braehead have a couple but have brought some guys up from EPL. A new Scottish team would need to do the same as Braehead most likely unless they want to outbid others either way they are possibly paying home grown depth close to an average import, these guys won't move all the way up to need to do a day job to cover the bills though a uni course may be an incentive. In terms of Scottish talent outside of elite you can maybe look at Solway Sharks playing in NIHL north 1 but outside of that there is just SNL and the gulf is huge. A morthern EPL would probably be an easier stepping stone for local players but if we had that then there would be less pro teams.

Having Dundee, Fife and Braehead has really helped Edinburgh in terms of rivalry to stay in the elite and the new conference system keeps things competitive. Dundee, Edinburgh and Fife with maybe Hull a couple of years ago were probably not far off looking at a northern equivalent to the EPL but there were just not enough of them to make it viable.

[grazza]

I don't know the details, but I understand the Flyers are unhappy with some goal decisions by the referees. Something about them being denied a goal or two...

yeah heard two goals chalked off, Edinburgh had one not allowed in Belfast last night, the webcast commentator said it was thrown in though I never had a replay to confirm that. Probably conspiracy theories will do the rounds, tonight's ref at Murrayfield made some harsh calls but don't think it effected the overall outcome.

[archibalduk]

A morthern EPL would probably be an easier stepping stone for local players but if we had that then there would be less pro teams.

This isn't quite along the same lines, but there are strong rumours Paisley will be joining the NIHL-1 North next season. Additionally, the teams have recently been expressing a wish to realign the league (in order to cut down on travel costs). The Northern NIHL-1 and NIHL-2 teams would be split into a Northern Division and a Midlands Division like so:

North: Solway, Billingham, Whitley, Blackburn Eagles, Blackburn Hawks, Fylde and Hull
Midlands: Telford, Coventry, Nottingham, Solihull, Sutton, Deeside, Trafford, Sheffield Senators and Sheffield Spartans

So we'd end up with three NIHL-1 divisions (North, Midlands and South). The Midlands Division would be a pretty weak league though with only Sutton and the Spartans as the strong teams. The North would be a little stronger with Solway, Billingham, Whitley and Blackburn Hawks. But the problem is that there is a huge gulf between the top and bottom of the NIHL-1, let alone between the top of the NIHL-1 and the bottom of the NIHL-2. Blackburn Eagles lost all 24 of their NIHL-2 games last season - so how are they going to cope with the likes of Solway, Billingham, Whitley and Blackburn Hawks?!

The EIHA has denied these rumours, but when so many of the NIHL-1 teams are wanting to realign, it makes you wonder whether the EIHA might eventually have a change of heart.

[rmt_1982]

I don't know the details, but I understand the Flyers are unhappy with some goal decisions by the referees. Something about them being denied a goal or two...

yeah heard two goals chalked off, Edinburgh had one not allowed in Belfast last night, the webcast commentator said it was thrown in though I never had a replay to confirm that. Probably conspiracy theories will do the rounds, tonight's ref at Murrayfield made some harsh calls but don't think it effected the overall outcome.

First one was disallowed because play had already been stopped before Fife bundled the puck in, and the second one was disallowed because a Fife player was laying across Kowalski in the Panthers goal.

[archibalduk]

I don't know the details, but I understand the Flyers are unhappy with some goal decisions by the referees. Something about them being denied a goal or two...

yeah heard two goals chalked off, Edinburgh had one not allowed in Belfast last night, the webcast commentator said it was thrown in though I never had a replay to confirm that. Probably conspiracy theories will do the rounds, tonight's ref at Murrayfield made some harsh calls but don't think it effected the overall outcome.

First one was disallowed because play had already been stopped before Fife bundled the puck in, and the second one was disallowed because a Fife player was laying across Kowalski in the Panthers goal.

Doesn't sound all that bad. The messages I was reading from the Fife players on Twitter suggested they were a lot more controversial than that. But I guess that's to be expected!

[rmt_1982]

Panthers vs Steelers last night, pretty good game, and the Panthers took the Challenge Cup despite losing 2-1 on the night. Fantastic atmosphere again.

Next up, Finals Weekend.

[MWE]

Steelers have signed Doug Christiansen as head coach

[archibalduk]

Steelers have signed Doug Christiansen as head coach

Yeah, it sounds like the larger budget was the main factor attracting him.

In other news, I was sorry to hear that the Leeb brothers are retiring. I really enjoyed seeing them play this season and they were two of my favourite players along with Guthrie who is also leaving (yes, I'm a secret Blaze fan! ).

The Playoff weekend was a lot of fun as always. I love the atmosphere and of course a weekend of nothing but hockey. The semis were both the typical conservative/cagey affairs until one team pulls away. The 3rd/4th game was, as expected, a dull exhibition game. The final was brilliant - such a shame the Giants couldn't get the winner (but they came oh so close several times). The Giants took a lot of penalties towards the end of the game and this really harmed their chances. After the game, David Ling did his water skiing impression with the trophy!

I was very impressed with Rupert Quiney of the Devils. I've seen him play a number of times for the NIHL Devils this season and he has always impressed. However, he didn't look out of depth in any way against the Panthers in the semi and the Blaze on the Sunday, and he rightly had a lot of ice time in both games. He's very versatile too - he seemed comfortable both at LD and LW. He's one to watch next season. Luke Ferrara (Devils) and James Griffin (Blaze) had good weekends too - Ferrara was able to keep up with the faster pace of the EIHL and Griffin was one of the Blaze's best players this weekend.

And Manchester won the playoffs!! What a result for a team with only 3 forward lines against an extremely strong Flames team who also benefit from good depth.

And finally, Invicta came back from a 6-4 loss to the NIHL Devils in game #1 to win 13-10 on aggregate. Unfortunately I'm going to miss the first leg of the semi-final, but I can't see them making it past the Chieftains. It's not impossible, but Chelmsford are so strong that it's going to take something special.

[rmt_1982]

Steelers have signed Doug Christiansen as head coach

Yeah, it sounds like the larger budget was the main factor attracting him.

In other news, I was sorry to hear that the Leeb brothers are retiring. I really enjoyed seeing them play this season and they were two of my favourite players along with Guthrie who is also leaving (yes, I'm a secret Blaze fan! ).

The Playoff weekend was a lot of fun as always. I love the atmosphere and of course a weekend of nothing but hockey. The semis were both the typical conservative/cagey affairs until one team pulls away. The 3rd/4th game was, as expected, a dull exhibition game. The final was brilliant - such a shame the Giants couldn't get the winner (but they came oh so close several times). The Giants took a lot of penalties towards the end of the game and this really harmed their chances. After the game, David Ling did his water skiing impression with the trophy!

I was very impressed with Rupert Quiney of the Devils. I've seen him play a number of times for the NIHL Devils this season and he has always impressed. However, he didn't look out of depth in any way against the Panthers in the semi and the Blaze on the Sunday, and he rightly had a lot of ice time in both games. He's very versatile too - he seemed comfortable both at LD and LW. He's one to watch next season. Luke Ferrara (Devils) and James Griffin (Blaze) had good weekends too - Ferrara was able to keep up with the faster pace of the EIHL and Griffin was one of the Blaze's best players this weekend.

And Manchester won the playoffs!! What a result for a team with only 3 forward lines against an extremely strong Flames team who also benefit from good depth.

And finally, Invicta came back from a 6-4 loss to the NIHL Devils in game #1 to win 13-10 on aggregate. Unfortunately I'm going to miss the first leg of the semi-final, but I can't see them making it past the Chieftains. It's not impossible, but Chelmsford are so strong that it's going to take something special.

Thought the final was a fantastic advert for Ice Hockey in the UK, as the pace didn't let up all game, and I think a few independent observers were pleasantly surprised with what was on offer. Still, the Panthers were made to fight for the win, and for Jordan Fox to score the winner is fitting, as he made the decision mid season to drop back to the blueline instead of being up top, and cost himself a lot of possible points in the process. However, he did score probably the goal of the season for us, and still weighed in with some very important points.

[Mighty Knight]

The London Racers have reformed, and plan to play in the ENIHL2 next season! Don't have an official website yet, but for those of you on Twitter; https://twitter.com/racers_london

[archibalduk]

The London Racers have reformed, and plan to play in the ENIHL2 next season! Don't have an official website yet, but for those of you on Twitter; https://twitter.com/racers_london

Brilliant news!!

I had heard rumours that the Harringay Greyhounds might be reforming following the refurbishment of the Ally Pally. I wonder if this is the alternative (because they Greyhounds would be starting in the NIHL-2) or whether both teams will be resurrected (surely fairly unlikely).

Thought the final was a fantastic advert for Ice Hockey in the UK, as the pace didn't let up all game, and I think a few independent observers were pleasantly surprised with what was on offer.

Paul Thompson made a couple of interesting Tweets on this topic shortly after the finals. The first one stated that a friend of his who is a coach in the DEL remarked that the level of play in the final was as good as the DEL in terms of quality. Another Tweet mentions Gunnar Svensson's (former Elitserien coach for 36 years) view that the EIHL is Europe's best kept secret (i.e. that it is overlooked more because of salary rather than quality/skill).

[Manimal]

Paul Thompson is moving to Sweden for next season. Gonna be an assistant coach for Troja-Ljungby in Swedish Allsvenskan (2nd tier)
He is bringing Shea Guthrie with him

Troja had Robert Dowd on the team this season. He did ok