The Official Olympics Hockey Thread

[Primis]

no..the talent is there in a few of the forwards. It was the "want" that was not there. There was not a point in that whole game where I ever feared them. The Canadians were just solid in every aspect. It was not about USA being bad or not having goal scorers (they do in Kessel, Kane, Kesler, Parise, and the list goes on) it was about Canada doing absolutely everything right.

That was why I thought US just didn't have enough though. It's not slighting Canada in saying that.

They worked pretty hard. They just simply didn't have the ability to get at a Canadian team that was firing on all cylinders defensively at least and seemed to do everything right. When that happens, you need a gamebreaker to do something, and USA doesn't have that available anywhere. Kane and Kessel are the closest, and they'd be 2nd tier scorers on Canada honestly. Someone on Twitter compared it to basketball and being able to "create your own shot". USA worked hard, battled, and went to the dirty areas of the ice, but ultimately you need someone that can BEAT the defense and really challenge the goalie. Despite Kane being advertised as it, in-game he's generally not really a dangler (especially on this stage) and neither is Kessel. Kane can roar in from the neutral zone, but then he needs to move the puck off to someone else because there was nothing there for him and he wasn't going to get through himself.

It's too bad in a way, because defensively the USA had a good game I thought and did what they needed/wanted to in that area. Orpik, Carlson, McDonagh... guys like that came up pretty big defensively in spots. You can't win if you don't score a single goal though.

[batdad]

You are kind of missing what I am saying. The US has the horses that COULD get to Canada. That could score. it is not the horses that were bad at all. They are good. It was the Canadians were and are better at the game. No gamebreaker would have made a difference. You have two of the five best gamebreakers in the game of hockey (kessel and Kane) and they could not get it done.

You do not seem to give Kane and Kesel the game breaking credit they deserve. They do, and they have shown it time and time again in their careers. Especially Kane...and not by passing the puck off..He is a dangerous game breaking scoring forward. Seen it sooooo many times in the playoffs. Now all that being said...I gave Kessel credit for being good? What the hell is wrong with me.

It is not American weakness. Give the credit (as you have done a little more in this post) to the proper team. Canada was better and were able to SHUT DOWN the gamebreakers. Bure, Ovechkin, Gretzky, Lemieux...maybe if you had all 4 of them. But one more super stud or two more would not have meant a thing.

Canada's super studs are just better. Carlson struggled a bit I thought, and Orpik was really having a hard time with the speed, but that is expected. McDonough was the best one and there were times he had a hard time with the pressue. Shattenkirk was HORRIBLE. Fowler had the rubbish kicked out of him.

I dunno, just from the tone of the post, you are saying a couple of better players and USA would have won. I really do not see that. Canada system and team play was just outrageous and I do not think adding any star gamebreaker would have helped USA today.


ALso--what if we had Stamkos? And not Kunitz?

USA had their best including gamebreakers, and goaltending that was unreal...and just could not get the job done. the gamebreakers were closest to being a threat, but were not really all that scary.

Really...it is not that USA was not good enough, it was just that CANADA was that darn good.

[nino33]

I'm not a Kessel fan, but I thought Kessel played OK for a player relied on to try and score (he seemed dangerous when on the offensive)...I thought the US D was the reason they lost, and that the 1-0 score flattered them (to me they were overmatched all game, and showed little puckmoving ability)


While I thought Canada played VERY well, again the lack of finishing/scoring puts them at risk of losing...but they didn't!

[XenHL]

That was an exciting game to watch.

Too much so in my opinion... I think Sweden will be a tougher test on Sunday. But GO CANADA!!!

[CJ]

I just hope we (Finland) win the Bronze medal today. I don't wanna see them lose again... I can't take it.

[ForNever]

Three 4th places in a row (2012 WC, 2013 WC & 2014 OG) would truly be frustrating... It's almost worse than not progressing to the semi-finals at all. But, as they say, hope dies last.

[XenHL]

Three 4th places in a row (2012 WC, 2013 WC & 2014 OG) would truly be frustrating... It's almost worse than not progressing to the semi-finals at all. But, as they say, hope dies last.

Just ask that Dutch speedskater!

But yes, Go Finland!!

[philou21]

Holy cow Finland kicked USA's butt. Didn't watched the game since I'm working but I wasn't expecting this to be a one-way game.

[Lazion]

It was sad to watch after-game interview of Selänne, Timonen and Salo.. Great players playing their last olympic games.
Selänne scored two goals and guaranteed our third olympic medal in a row.

[Manimal]

Didn't watch the bronze medal game as those usually are so dull. It is usually two disappionted teams that have just lost the semis. Only the underdog teams really care about the game

[ForNever]

Well, in this case the numbers don't tell all the truth. USA really did try to win the bronze, hell they even had two penalty shots. It wasn't until last period that Finland went their way. But still, I'm surprised that USA melted like so, guess they didn't have the right atmosphere in the team to win. Nevertheless a great victory for Team Finland and I am really thankful for Selänne, Timonen and Salo with their honorable careers. It was hard to watch Timonen crying in the interview postgame. Thanks for the years, Teemu still has one job to do though. Nothing's going to stop the number 1 team in the NHL this spring...

A medal's a medal!

[nino33]

I think North American players still struggle to play in such games...there's never been a "third place game" in NA sports as far as I'm aware (the losing teams from the semis in football/baseball/hockey/basketball NEVER play each other)

[CJ]

I'm so glad we won the bronze medal! Especially when there were old guys like Selänne, Timonen and Salo. To end their international career with a victory and get a bronze medal is really something!

I think North American players still struggle to play in such games...there's never been a "third place game" in NA sports as far as I'm aware (the losing teams from the semis in football/baseball/hockey/basketball NEVER play each other)

Olympic medal is something you don't have a chance to get everyday. In skiing... Guys fight for the medals, even if they know they won't win the gold, they still fight really hard to get that bronze. It should be important, it's the Olympics. The best in the world compete.

Gold is everything, and Metallica "Nothing Else Matters" attitude is really arrogant.

I'm not aware of any league in hockey/soccer that would give a bronze to the third placed, silver to the second. Olympics and World Cup football/soccer I'm aware about. It's not like NA is the only part in the world not familiar with the bronze/silver medal. My question here is why would it be more important to European countries than NA?

[batdad]

WHat nino is getting at is it is win or bust for the USA and CANADA in most team sports. There is never a thought that 3rd place is a good thing. It means failure...so they do not care, and go through the motions. Especially when you are now thinking about going back to your NHL team and winning a Stanley Cup. Way more things on the minds of those guys.

But that being said..you are right that the chance for an Olympic medal only comes around if you are a lucky dude, and to not get one, kind of sucks for them....and should mean more. But I do not think it does. IT is just the NA mentality of win or bust, and they just go through motions.

That being said, Americans were trying until they got down a couple, then packed up and went home.

[CJ]

"Maybe" that's just an excuse!? It "could" be, as it sound like a good one.

I know Canada had or has that problem in hockey. But for the US it shouldn't be the same thing. They're not THE hockey country.
_____________________________

It will be interesting tomorrow as Canada has never won on "big ice" before. (not counting hockey 50 years ago, I don't even know how the ice looked back then.)

[philou21]

I don't think outside hockey we have that problem. Most athletes I've seen winning bronze so far were really happy. Since hockey is our national sport I understand it's gold or nothing.

[batdad]

Nah USA has that problem too, because they think they are better at anything and everything. And of course..it is a lame arse excuse....but legit in that I know I probably would not have even WATCHED the BRonze medal game if Canada was in. Win or bust. I am sure there are a ton of Americans like that. Just do not care (even at the best of times most Americans do not care about hockey) about a game for 3rd place.

[CJ]

"Latvian hockey player Vitalijs Pavlovs fails doping test"

[nino33]

I think North American players still struggle to play in such games...there's never been a "third place game" in NA sports as far as I'm aware (the losing teams from the semis in football/baseball/hockey/basketball NEVER play each other)

I was simply trying to say the experience of a 3rd place game is something that is foreign in North America. I wasn’t referring to NA hockey players (allegedly) making excuses for losing, or athletes in obscure sports being happy to win gold, or (alleged) American hubris …I was talking about how third place games don’t exist in the 4 major sports in North America: football (NFL/NCAA/CFL), baseball (MLB), basketball (NBA) and hockey (NHL). Who finished 3rd last year in any of these Leagues? Nobody, because there’s no such thing as a “third place game” in major/pro NA sports – that was my only point


Also IMO the NA interest in Olympic Hockey is because it’s the only “best on best” tournament around right now
I remember decades of hockey before then, when the Olympics was amateurs and/or non-NHLers, and there was little NA interest compared to now (and if NHLers aren't part of the Olympics in the future there'll be little NA interest again IMO)…what mattered then was the Canada/World Cup (which didn’t have 3rd place games)...it’s only since pros have been involved in the Olympics that they’ve mattered as much in Canada

My understanding is the European/Russian Leagues shut down every year for the World Championships (and they always have)...but that doesn't happen in NA (and there's not a lot of coverage of the Worlds, given in NA the NHL playoffs are occurring at the same time)...I was just saying North Americans pros lack experience with 3rd place games

[CJ]

I was just saying North Americans pros lack experience with 3rd place games

Yes I understand what you mean. But that sounds like there are "third placed games" in European sports, and we're used to it!? Nothing comes to mind.
I only know Olympic hockey, and World Cup Football/Soccer. Formula One has it in the competitions, but at the end of the season there's only one winner.

[nino33]

that sounds like there are "third placed games" in European sports, and we're used to it!? Nothing comes to mind

The Olympics and the World Championships come to mind for me...I guess I was thinking that every year at the Worlds Europeans/Russians paid attention. I was thinking that Europeans/Russians grow up with the Olympics/Worlds, I thought they were part of the "hockey culture" in Europe/Russia.

I thought European/Russian hockey fans paid attention to the Worlds every year (where there are 3rd place games every year). Are the professional hockey leagues in Europe/Russia continuing to play games during the World Championships every year like the NHL?...are you're telling me it's more like NA, where the Olympics have only mattered since the pros are there, and the Worlds are pretty much ignored?

[CJ]

I thought European/Russian hockey fans paid attention to the Worlds every year (where there are 3rd place games every year). Are the professional hockey leagues in Europe/Russia continuing to play games during the World Championships every year like the NHL?...are you're telling me it's more like NA, where the Olympics have only mattered since the pros are there, and the Worlds are pretty much ignored?

I forgot the WC. Yes we pay attention the the WC. But not as much as the Olympics of course. "You" play those bronze games as much as we do (World Championships).

Are the professional hockey leagues in Europe/Russia continuing to play games during the World Championships every year like the NHL?

I haven't talked about any league "breaks" here have I?

[nino33]

I thought European/Russian hockey fans paid attention to the Worlds every year (where there are 3rd place games every year). Are the professional hockey leagues in Europe/Russia continuing to play games during the World Championships every year like the NHL?...are you're telling me it's more like NA, where the Olympics have only mattered since the pros are there, and the Worlds are pretty much ignored?

I forgot the WC. Yes we pay attention the the WC. But not as much as the Olympics of course. "You" play those bronze games as much as we do (World Championships).

No, "we" are playing in the NHL playoffs HaHa
While players of teams that missed or are knocked out of the playoffs participate, the Worlds get very little attention in NA

Are the professional hockey leagues in Europe/Russia continuing to play games during the World Championships every year like the NHL?

I haven't talked about any league "breaks" here have I?

I like learning about other "hockey nations" from those that are actually there...Archi, yourself, Manimal, Alessandro and others have helped me better understand the "hockey culture" beyond North America

I was trying to reciprocate HaHa by trying to better explain NA hockey culture, though it doesn't seem I've done a very good job

I brought up how the European/Russian Leagues don't play in the Worlds to hopefully help show how the Worlds (with 3rd place games) are so much a part of the European/Russian hockey culture by pointing out that their professional leagues don't play any games during the worlds! All players from European/Russian leagues are available, and the fans of European/Russian hockey can focus 100% on the Worlds...meanwhile in North America virtually all the attention is on the NHL playoffs, which carry on regardless of the Worlds

I was trying to contrast the different hockey cultures (not saying one or the other is better or worse; if it was up to me we'd reduce the number of NHL teams by 30% or more, and we'd reduce the number of NHL games played, and the NHL would cease play during the Worlds too...but it's not up to me! HaHa)

[philou21]

Don't talk with him, he's drunk. Nothing makes sense.

[Primis]

There was never a prayer the U.S. was going to really show up for the Bronze game. I actually wondered if they'd dress some reserves for it to give them experience even.

For amateur players... a Bronze would probably mean something. If the U.S. and Canada still sent collegiate and minor league guys? It'd means something to them.

To NHLers making millions and who have had it beaten into their heads for years that either you win the Stanley Cup or you're just another loser.... the concept of Bronze doesn't compute probably. Canada and U.S. both are going to be Gold Or Bust.