Realignment and More Coming to NHL?

[Minstrel]

The league... or more specifically 6 teams and Bettman have come up with a plan to realign the NHL and you don't have to be Nostradamus to look at a league with two conferences with 7 teams and two with 8 and realize that Bettman is just deluded enough to actually be considering expansion again.

Here's a great article at ESPN that everyone should check out on the matter:

http://sports.espn.go.com/nhl/columns/s ... id=2706503

Now I think those of you who have been listening to Uncle Minty ramble on about the "Ownership Plan" here in Chicago won't find it much of a shock to find out like I did that the major proponent of this plan? None other than the Wirtzford Dynasty themselves. Less Travel? More teams make the playoffs? And additional set of playoff games that are easier to make it into and still give us that sweet sweet bonus cash? Oh yeah! Where do we sign??

Ya see as I've mentioned good Ole Dollar Bill Wirtz owns near all the parking around the United Center, a good chunk of the concessions and ALL of the liquor distribution rights (as that's what made him the billionaire he is...). He gets a giant chunk of everything and designs the team every with only one goal in mind "compete to make the playoffs". He doesn't care if they win, he only cares that they make it so he can get those extra games where he doesn't have to pay player salaries and the place packs in with opposing fans wanting see their team face the Hawks in the playoffs and he can (and does) then charge double for tickets and parking and concessions. It's the playoffs!

So, when a plan is floated to realign the NHL and in the process make it so it would require an extra "play-in" round in the playoffs effectively making is so four extra teams make the playoffs you should know you don't need six steps to trace this back to Kevin Bacon Chicago. And Bill Wirtz and his other Billionaire Boyfriends that own franchises will all band together and coerce the other votes they might need and they have 10 teams that can HATE everythign about this and it won't matter as long as those 20 vote yes. So this WILL happen, mark my words.

The big "catch" here is that Columbus and Atlanta will switch conferences, which Atlanta will never go for. But they don't have to; only 20 of the teams need to agree to realignment; and when Dollar Bill gets all the old school billionaires out on his yacht and all liquored up the refrain will be "We've owned these teams for decades who cares if it inconveniences some darn expansion team?!?! Vote yes and we all get a chance at getting post season money easier than ever!" And a rousing cheer goes up from the decks of the USS Blackhawk (Wirtz's luxury yacht you can find anchored prominently in Chicago's most expensive harbor). Wait, how many teams did the initial report say met with Bettman about this? Six? Hmm... how many Original Franchises were there... Ahh... interesting.

I gave this no chance as a Bettman idea doubting he could sway the new teams to go for it, but then I heard it was Wirtz that was the proponent and all his old school old money cornies and that's a huge difference.

[inSTAALed]

I actually like the idea to tell you the truth...

It's a helluva lot better than alot of the other changes they've made...

[E5150_ca]

Wanna improve the number of people coming to your teams game? Heres what you do. Get a map of Canada, close your eyes, and move your finger around. Wherever it stops, move your arena there. Instant sell outs.

[B. Stinson]

I heard about this yesterday during the Flyers game, and I think I like it. Not because of any financial reasons or anything - just because I like the idea of less divisions in the league. Ultimately, I'd prefer there to be just one whole league like many European leagues do it... but for now I'll take four divisions over the current six.

Though, my brain is unable to come up with any possible reason for having Atlanta and Columbus switch conferences. ... but then again, this is the NHL - The "Strange Ideas" capital of the world.

[Minstrel]

I think it would be even odder to put Atlanta in with the predominantly East Coast teams... so while the shift of Columbus to the East is odd since they're a better fit in the Central it would be even odder to have shifted Atlanta if those are the two options. Eithere way they're kind of screwed but I think they're screwed less if they are put in the Central not the Northeast

Proposed:

Eastern Conference
Northeast Division
Boston
Buffalo
Columbus
Montreal
Ottawa
Pittsburgh
Toronto

and

Western Conference
Central Division
Atlanta
Chicago
Dallas
Detroit
Minnesota
Nashville
St. Louis

Oh, and also a part of this plan would be less games 6 instead of 8 within your division so teams would see all NHL teams every two years... another topic I'm sure Wirtz is very keen on since the only drawing cards for Chicago is the opposing teams.

[CatchUp]

I like this idea.

I agree that there are too many divisions already and the schedule is majorly messed up because of time zone differences. This switch fixes both problems.

Although, the writing is on the wall that Bettman wants to expand again. Can anyone say 2 new franchises for 2008-09? One in the East and one in the West.

I'm betting on Kansas City in the East and Vegas in the West.

[Systemfel]

Come on, move Detroit to the East!

[Thundercleese]

If this plan cuts down on travel disparity between East and West I'm in support, as much as I don't want the Flames to be in a division with the Ducks (shudder). It's really not fair that Eastern teams don't leave their time zone more than once a year in a lot of cases while Western teams have to every other night almost.

[Minstrel]

Come on, move Detroit to the East!

Just curious but why would you want Detroit moved to the East?

As for travel disparity yeah it's pretty crazy... I think it's the Devils that after the second week of November don't leave their time zone for the rest of the season or something totally insane like that while teams like the Sharks are in four time zones in 5 five days... and they were saying that wile it does given them a bit of a psychological edge since they are more used to the kind of travel schedule teams get into for the playoffs a team from the Pacific has never won it all. (And to me that sounds just totally wrong... but that's what htey said on their pregame the other night I think).

I do hope they lower the season from 82 to 76 games, as it's a difference of having one extra night a week off and I think by the end of the year that would make teams less exhausted mentally and physically once they reach the playoffs finally. That too will help ease travel stressors.

As for the obvious push for completely un-needed and unwarranted expansion my bet is Vegas (isn't that where Cuban wants to locate a team he'd purchase? I honestly wouldn't mind getting Cuban in as an owner just to watch him shake up the old Billionaire Boys Club), Pittsburgh moves, and second expansion will be just to make a crazy but still possible call? Houston. Texas has become a giant grassroots hockey state actually and there are tons of young fans in those areas. Personally? I'd like to see an NHL team in Chicago.

I can't help but still look at two 8 team divs and two 7 team divisions and think they should contract by two teams instead of expand by two.

[Systemfel]

Just curious but why would you want Detroit moved to the East?

Better competition? Would be fun, I guess.

[BruceM]

Dallas has won it all and two other teams from the Pacific have made it to the final, LA & Anaheim. Although they're not in the Pacific Division, Col, Edm, Cgy, & Van are all pretty much west coast and have been to the show and with the exception of Van, have won it all too.

I agree the travel thing isn't fair for West Coast teams but they have a good track record in the play-offs so I don't think it's that much of a detriment.

[batdad]

To chime in..realignment makes no sense. Unless you are contemplating, preparing for movement and expansion in the west. No way Bettman lets the Pens and their stars move west to Seattle, or even KCity. So expansion it is. Atlanta would stay in the east, and CBJ or Det would move there.

As for the travel issue, if it is not really a problem, then why does every single player who has EVER played on an East Coast team, and a West Coast team bring it up as an issue.
I believe there is a division in the East that does not leave their time zone this season after November, and plays all of 3 or 4 games outside of their zone..

Vancouver plays all of about 6 or 8 (LA, SJ and Ana only). Eastern teams sleep in their own homes 90% of the time. Western teams 50-60%. Of course travel is a major freaking issue. The only reason Western teams overcome travel and make it to the final (with the exception of the Central Division and Dallas who are really Mid West-Eastern teams) is that they have to beat each other. A real western team actually winning the cup is the exception. Detroit, CBJ, StL, Nas, and Chicago are NOT really western teams. Their travel is more difficult than it should be becuase of their matchups with Ana, Van, LA, SJ et al...but they also get many more matchups in their own timezones. Easier travel.

In the last 10 years is their a team from the Pacific or NorthWest division that has actually won the Stanley Cup? Yes, two Dallas (enough said) and...a super loaded Colorado team with a high paid god in goal, 4 high paid gods on defense ,and 5 high paid gods up front. Under the cap era, cannot happen. In the cap ERA I would disagree vehemently that a TRUE Western team has the same chance/opportunity to win a cup than an Eastern based, or Mid-West based team. Travel alone exhausts them. Ask Luongo after this season on the difference. Betcha travel comes up.

[CatchUp]

To chime in..realignment makes no sense. Unless you are contemplating, preparing for movement and expansion in the west. No way Bettman lets the Pens and their stars move west to Seattle, or even KCity. So expansion it is. Atlanta would stay in the east, and CBJ or Det would move there.

As for the travel issue, if it is not really a problem, then why does every single player who has EVER played on an East Coast team, and a West Coast team bring it up as an issue.
I believe there is a division in the East that does not leave their time zone this season after November, and plays all of 3 or 4 games outside of their zone..

Vancouver plays all of about 6 or 8 (LA, SJ and Ana only). Eastern teams sleep in their own homes 90% of the time. Western teams 50-60%. Of course travel is a major freaking issue. The only reason Western teams overcome travel and make it to the final (with the exception of the Central Division and Dallas who are really Mid West-Eastern teams) is that they have to beat each other. A real western team actually winning the cup is the exception. Detroit, CBJ, StL, Nas, and Chicago are NOT really western teams. Their travel is more difficult than it should be becuase of their matchups with Ana, Van, LA, SJ et al...but they also get many more matchups in their own timezones. Easier travel.

In the last 10 years is their a team from the Pacific or NorthWest division that has actually won the Stanley Cup? Yes, two Dallas (enough said) and...a super loaded Colorado team with a high paid god in goal, 4 high paid gods on defense ,and 5 high paid gods up front. Under the cap era, cannot happen. In the cap ERA I would disagree vehemently that a TRUE Western team has the same chance/opportunity to win a cup than an Eastern based, or Mid-West based team. Travel alone exhausts them. Ask Luongo after this season on the difference. Betcha travel comes up.

Not to point out anything wrong with your post...but your frist sentence says that you think realignment makes no sense, but the rest of your post is about the travel mismatch between the conferences. Realignment would theoretically fix most of the travel issues. Keep the western teams mainly in the west and vice versa. It does make a lot more sense.

So are you for it or against it?

[BruceM]

In the last 10 years is their a team from the Pacific or NorthWest division that has actually won the Stanley Cup? Yes, two Dallas (enough said) and...a super loaded Colorado team with a high paid god in goal, 4 high paid gods on defense ,and 5 high paid gods up front. Under the cap era, cannot happen. In the cap ERA I would disagree vehemently that a TRUE Western team has the same chance/opportunity to win a cup than an Eastern based, or Mid-West based team. Travel alone exhausts them. Ask Luongo after this season on the difference. Betcha travel comes up.

In 2001 super loaded Colorado beat a super loaded eastern team in the finals. As far as true western teams having a chance in the new Cap era, there a few western teams that have a very legitimate shot this season. ANA & SJS come to mind right away, and how do you explain Edm last season and Cgy in 03/04? Both lost in game 7 by 1 goal basically and Cgy was low payroll when they did it.

Having said all that, I agree the travel problem is an issue, but I'll never be convinced that it's as detrimenatl as everyone's making it out to be.

[batdad]

1. Realignment, unless they reschedule even more so than they have now and discontinue West to East travel completely will never allow for Western travel to be the same as Eastern travel. It is just not possible. All teams, players in fans in the west realize that. Changing teams divisions will not help travel to any major extent for teams like the Canucks, Kings, Sharks and Ducks. They will always have the worst travel schedules until Portland, Seattle and San Fransisco get NHL teams. However, expansion...BAD NEWS. Teams are watered down enough as it is.

2. Legit chance--Yep they do have legit chances. They are NHL players after all. The point is not so much their chance to win the cup I guess, as it is about the fact that it is way more bloody difficult for Calgary, Edmonton, Vancouver, LA, Ana, SJ to get to the final with the travel they have to get there. And even when they do get there...they are freaking tired. Another point to this is that the Western Conf (until this season) has been considered the dominant conference, yet Western teams that reach the final (Edm, Cal, Ana) have not had enough gas left in the tank to beat the winner of the supposedly weaker conference.
I would never expect someone from the east to understand how detrimental/difficult Western travel is...it is just hard to put those shoes on and visualize that during a 300 day season, 120 are spent in hotels in other cities, in other time zones...whereas in the east it is at the lowest 15 of 300 nights in hotels, and maybe 5 (with the way the schedule is) in other time zones at the absolute most. That takes a gargantuan toll on the body.
As an example, the Cancuks played 3 games in 4 nights last week, Minnesota, Boston and Columbus,not one in their own time zone. Yes, Eastern teams do this when they play their western road trip games. But they do it once a year. The Canucks have already done it, 3 times this year. As have the Kings. Sorry, it is just harder, and makes it much less likely for a team to have gas in the playoffs.

I do not expect people to agree with this, and have no way to "convert" people. Just when people from the east do not see Western teams the way we out west do not see Eastern teams (except the Frigging laffs every freaking Sat nite) I feel I should explain some of the differences.

[BruceM]

I do not expect people to agree with this, and have no way to "convert" people. Just when people from the east do not see Western teams the way we out west do not see Eastern teams (except the Frigging laffs every freaking Sat nite) I feel I should explain some of the differences.

I fully understand the differences having lived in Victoria for 5 years in the 90's and in Van for 2 years back in the 70's. I see Western Teams the way you do. I've followed the NHL religiously since the late 50's and am not just rambling on about something I know nothing about.

The travel problem is real.

The travel problem is not as detrimental as some people make it out to be.

I watched the 03 final between Ana & NJ. I watched the 04 final between Cgy & TB, and the 06 final between Edm & Car. NJ, TB, & Car didn't have any more "gas" left in the tank than their oposition. Anyone watching those series could easily see how close they were and how they could have gone either way.

In 96, 97, & 98 when the Av's and Red Wings won their cups, they did a lot of travelling in the play-offs yet managed to sweep the finals each time. I suppose that's because they had "Loaded" teams?

[Minstrel]

The travel problem is real.

The travel problem is not as detrimental as some people make it out to be.

I simply disagree with you on your claim that it is not as detrimental as some people make it out to be, it as a massive issue and one that affect the team for the entire year not just in the playoffs. So solely focusing upon who seemed "fresher" from watching playoff games doesn't lend half as much weight to proving your position as do the simple facts of the year long travel schedules of the west versus the east. They can make it just like any team in the league can make it but they are pushing the team bus uphill all year while other teams are joyriding downhill for most of it and that is a significant factor.

[batdad]

Didn't they? I mean really...clearly they did.

No team can have that kind of squad now with the cap. Unless maybe the Ducks with their million superstar younguns. But yeah, I fully believe Col and Det pretty much bought themselves cups. Yes they had some great drafts (Sakic, Hejduk, Yzerman, Lidstrom) and built some from within. But they paid for alot too...Roy, Shanahan, Blake, Chelios, and numerous rental players. Under the old rules that was fine...but now can't do it re the cap...and as I said...Detroit not really a western team.

Anyway, enough about this from me. The point is being missed anyway. Probably not your fault Bruce--my wording is not making what I am saying clear.

[grazza]

It is intresting that in basketball LA has 2 teams in that city. In baseball NY has 3 I believe though I would imagine that at least one is in long island but is there just 1 in NYC.

So considering hockey is so huge in Canada could a 2nd team in a city work. Say Toronto for example. Though I do think it has been too long and the maple leafs are so big now that it is too late to do so. Though perhaps if it has been done a long time ago people would have just accepted it. But when you look at football (soccer) in Scotland the bigger cities have 2 big teams and they do ok and thrive off the rivalry between each other. Its hard to say how applicable this would be in ice hockey.

Though not being from north america I do not understand the culture as well as locals will. So does anyone think that there is any city that a 2nd team could work. Granted it would cost a fair bit to set up with paying license fees to current team but there may not need be the cost to build an arena.

Anyway back to realistic possibilities for expansion.

Las Vegas - been there myself a few years ago. Strange place for ice hockey. Not sure they have a big enough arena for NHL. Though i'm sure it could get build and be well used for variety of events. The city does have a population apparantly of permanent residents of 1 million which I found hard to believe. The weather is very hot but really I guess the same can be said for Phoenix. Would be pretty easy to stick them in pacific as well. Sponsorship should come easily but with so many options for entertainment in this citys fans may only back a winning team. Would not want to see a current city lose a team to LV.

Kansas City - I know very little about this city so maybe others could say more.

Seattle - Seems a bit too close to Vancouver. Though they have NBA and NFL teams I believe. Ain;t sure what the population is. Though I don't even think they have a minor team though their is the juniour one.

I ain't really convinced expansion is a good idea. 30 teams really is enough. If a city wants to be seriously considered they should be getting reasonable crowds at minor level. Also there may be the worry of dilution of talent. If it expanded by 2 teams and was 32 then well ok but never expand beyond that ever again. Then could have 4 divisions of 8.

For the play in idea that well may be ok but i think only if the league was bigger. Too many teams getting a chance would really make a mockery of the regular season.